picture of 20th century fundamentalist Evangelist Billy Sunday
If you are not knowledgeable about the Independent Fundamentalist Baptist (IFB) church movement, please take the time to read the following posts I have written:
Independent Fundamentalist Baptist Lingo, A Guide to IFB Speak
The Independent Fundamentalist Baptist Church, the 20/20 Story
Independent Fundamentalist Baptists and the Secrets They Keep
Salvation, Independent Fundamentalist Baptist Style
An Independent Baptist Hate List
One of the common objections given by my critics is that I am an athiest, and because I am an atheist my writing on the IFB should be rejected or ignored. In others words, ignore the message because the messenger isn’t one of us.
Ignore me all they want, they know I have the bona fides necessary to be an authoritative writer on the IFB church movement.
I was raised in the IFB church, saved in the IFB church, baptized in the IFB church, and called to preach in the IFB church. I attended an IFB college, Midwestern Baptist College, in the 1970’s, the heyday of the IFB church movement.
The chancellor of Midwestern Baptist College, Tom Malone, was one of the top dogs in the IFB. During my time at Midwestern, I heard virtually every one of the big-name IFB preachers.
From 1979 to 1998, I pastored IFB churches in Ohio and Texas. I attended numerous Sword of the Lord Conferences and I regularly attended the Ohio Baptist Bible Fellowship Pastor’s Fellowship and the Buckeye Independent Baptist Fellowship.
Over the years, I attended or preached at IFB church Youth Camps. I was a guest speaker at a number of IFB churches. I started an IFB Youth Fellowship in SE Ohio. The IFB churches I pastored supported IFB missionaries.
My wife is the daughter of an IFB pastor. Her uncle is a noted leader in the IFB church movement. She has first cousins who are IFB pastors/evangelists or married to men who are. All of the men in our wedding party are/were IFB pastors.
I wrote all of the above to say, I know what I am talking about.
My recent writing on the latest sex scandal at First Baptist Church in Hammond, Indiana has brought thousands and thousands of new readers to this blog. My posts have been linked to on other sites and Facebook and thousands more have stopped by to read what I have written on this subject.
Some commenters on this blog and other sites have attempted to distance themselves from the Jack Schaap scandal by suggesting that while they are proudly IFB, they are NOT IFB like Jack Schaap.
While I fully understand why IFB pastors and parishioners would want to distance themselves from Jack Schaap and First Baptist Church in Hammond, I think they “doth protest to much.”
What makes a church an IFB church? In a previous post titled, What is an IFB church?, I wrote:
I stands for Independent
The local, visible Church is an independent body of believers who are not associated or affiliated with any denomination. The pastor answers only to God, and to a lesser degree the Church. The Church answers to no one but God. Most IFB churches oppose any form of government involvement or intrusion into its affairs.
F stands for Fundamentalist
The independent Church is fundamentalist in its doctrine and practice. IFB churches are social and theological fundamentalists. Social fundamentalists adhere to an external code of conduct. Often this code of conduct is called Church standards. The Bible, or should I say the pastor’s interpretation of the Bible, is the rule by which church members are expected to live. IFB churches spend a significant amount of time preaching and teaching about how
Godthe pastor expects people to live.IFB churches are also theological fundamentalists. They adhere to a certain and specific theological standard, a standard by which all other Christians and denominations are judged. Every IFB pastor and church believes things like:
- The inspiration, infallibility, and inerrancy of the Bible
- The sinfulness, depravity of man
- The deity of Christ
- The virgin birth of Christ
- The blood atonement of Christ for man’s sin
- The resurrection of Christ from the dead
- The second coming of Christ
- Separation from the world
- Salvation from sin is by and through Christ alone
- Personal responsibility to share the gospel with sinners
- Heaven and hell are literal places
- Hierarchal authority (God, Jesus, church, pastor, husband, wife)
- Autonomy and independence of the local church
I am sure other doctrines could be added to this list but the list above is a concise list of ALL things an IFB church and pastor must believe to be considered an IFB church.
B stands for Baptist
IFB churches are Baptist Churches adhering to the ecclesiology and theology mentioned above. Some IFB churches are landmark Baptists or Baptist briders. They believe the Baptist church is the true church and all other churches are false churches. John the Baptist baptized Jesus, which made him a Baptist and the first churches established by the Baptist apostles were Baptist churches. Churches like this go to great lengths to prove their Baptist lineage which dates all the way back to John the Baptist, Jesus and the Apostles.
Other IFB churches and pastors believe that Baptist ecclesiology and theology are what the Bible clearly teaches. They grudgingly admit that other denominations “might” be Christian too but they are quick to say why be a part of a bastardized form of Christianity when you can have the real deal.
Some Southern Baptist churches can be rightly labeled IFB churches. They are Southern Baptist in name only. It is not uncommon for an IFB pastor to pastor a Southern Baptist church with the intent of pulling them out of the Southern Baptist convention. It is not uncommon for Southern Baptist churches to reject resumes from pastors with a IFB background. Area missionaries warn churches about pernicious IFB pastors who desire to take over churches and pull the churches out of the convention.
When IFB churches fight among themselves, they usually fight over:
- Bible translations
- Ecclesiastical separation (secondary separation)
- Personal standards of separation
- Preacher personalities
- Music styles
- Soteriological and Eschatological differences
IFB churches all generally believe the same things and tend to fight among themselves over the small differences they have with each other. Remember this is a movement known for what it is against rather than what it is for.
IFB churches are generally subdivided according to the IFB college the church and/or pastor is associated with. They tend to fellowship with their own kind but they do often join together for conferences, revival meetings, and fellowships.
The IFB is subdivided around the following colleges (this is not an exhaustive list)
- Bob Jones University
- Pensacola Christian College
- Hyles-Anderson College
- Midwestern Baptist College
- Maranatha Baptist Bible College
- Baptist Bible College
- Tennessee Temple
- Massillon Baptist College
- Heartland Baptist Bible College
- Landmark Baptist College
- Arlington Baptist College
- Fairhaven Baptist College
- Crown College of the Bible
- West Coast Baptist College
- Faith Baptist Bible College
- Ambassador Baptist College
- Trinity Baptist College
- Cedarville University
- Northland Baptist Bible College
- Texas Baptist College
- The Masters College
All of these colleges teach Bible literalism and believe the Bible is the inerrant, inspired Word of God. Most of them are unaccredited.
There are several “denominations” that are aggregates of IFB churches (again, not exhaustive):
- The General Association of Regular Baptists (GARBC)
- Conservative Baptist Association
- The Baptist Bible Fellowship
- Independent Fundamentalist Churches of America
- Reformed Baptist Fellowship
- Association of Reformed Baptists
Within the Southern Baptist Convention, American Baptist Convention, General Baptist Convention, and National Baptist Convention there are thousands of churches that could be described doctrinally as IFB churches.
Then you have the Independent IFB churches. (yes, I know that sounds like an oxymoron but it is not) These churches and pastors who are fiercely independent. Many of them are Calvinistic, Reformed, Sovereign Grace, or Primitive Baptist churches.
There are numerous IFB churches not affiliated with any college, fellowship, or denomination. These churches tend to keep to themselves or fellowship with a few likeminded churches.
IFB churches are everywhere. For decades they flew under the radar but in recent years sexual and financial scandals have turned the spotlight on them and they don’t like it one bit.
This is why IFB churches and pastors try to distance themselves from erring churches and pastors. They fear getting tarred with the same brush or they fear that the light might be shown on their own aberrant beliefs and practices.
Less than two days after the Jack Schaap scandal was made public, Schaap’s name, sermons, and the like, were scoured from websites. This is the way the IFB church movement handles its scandals…they wave the magic eraser wand and everything is right again.
Except that it is not right at all. Until the IFB church movement changes its doctrine and ecclesiology these abuses continue. As long as they continue to spiritually abuse people and demean and debase them through “hard preaching” these kind of scandals will continue. As long as pastors are considered demigods they will continue to use their absolute power and control of the church to squash dissent, run off those who oppose them, and mentally, emotionally, and spiritually abuse those who call them “pastor.” Until the cancerous head is cut of there is no hope of a cure for the IFB church movement.
The denial of basic human sexuality will continue to breed “moral” failure among IFB pastors, evangelists, college professors, and parishioners. Continuing to teach people to “deny self” will only result in excessive behavior and acting out.
I am often asked, is the IFB church movement a cult? Some churches are indeed cults. However, most IFB churches are not cults in the classic sense. They have “cultic” tendencies and these tendencies are troubling.
I can not in good conscience recommend that a person attend an IFB church. I know and have seen too much to ever recommend an IFB church to anyone. I think IFB churches hurt people mentally, emotionally, and spiritually. The danger of abuse is quite high and there are better alternatives for those needing a “connection” with God.
The IFB church movement is dying…that’s the good news. The bad news is that they are dying a very slow death and until they finally kick the bucket they will continue hurt countless people.
I hope this blog can be a help in pointing people to a better way, be it joining up with a progressive/liberal church or joining the ranks of the godless.
An excellent, and succinct, summary Bruce of the IFB world.
Excellent job. But why mince words? You are describing a cult. Yes, I know you can’t get agreement on a formal definition, but there is a lot of general agreement on an operational definition. I was once in a Christian cult and it taught all this same crap. . Enroth’s book Churches That Abuse helped me extricate myself. At bottom, cults are about control. Christian cults use euphemisms like Discipling or Accountability. It’s just control.
If you are an adult and your church ssys you have to get permission from some other mammal for any decision you make about your life — who you can date, if you can date, whether you can spend time with your parents or siblings, whether you can take a new job, or buy a house or car, or read a particular book, or see a movie, or take a vacation, you are already trapped. If they say leaving the church will bring judgement on you, it’s now a noose. If your time is not your own, and you are subject to criticism when you don’t give every waking moment to the church, run while you can. If amateurs with no professional license or training presume to “counsel” you about personal issues, demand to know your private thoughts, and accuse you of being defensive when you don’t comply, you are in real serious danger. Get the hell out of there as fast as you can.
If you are lucky, you will someday finally discover that it was all a bunch of bullshit, and you might start actually enjoying your life. If you are really, really lucky, you will start watching Hitchens,Harris, Dawkins, and Krauss videos on YouTube, and discover that the still, silent voice that whispers on your head is not the devil, it is your own voice of Reason. Eventually, you might conclude, based on the evidence, that there is no god. And everything will finally, at last, make perfect sense. As Ayaan Hirsi Ali noted, when she stopped believing in the mythical sky god , the cognitive dissonance finally stopped.
Sorry for the rant. But knowing what these kind of churches do, and how many innocent lives they ruin, all in the service of the leaders who pretend to know the sky-god’s will, just makes my blood boil.
Well stated!
I agree totally.
So true! I’ve seen a lot of that stuff you mention too…so glad to be out of that type of environment.
Oh Rob, thanks so much for the rant. I am saving it. Because I have a feeling I may need it someday. I promise to paraphrase and won’t publish it…just for personal use among the crazy people I’m related to.
Ami, you are welcome to it. There’s plenty more where that came from, trust me. I didn’t even get into the subject of money in that one.
wow
Thanks for this Bruce!
Yep, 22,000 congregations. Dozens of new colleges. Over 4,000 missionaries all over the planet. Sounds like it’s really dying. I will be attending 160 year anniversary at a little old country IFB church. This little church had an attendance of 8 people 5 years ago…today this church has an attendance of 100 people. Incredible if you realize it is on a country gravel road, 16 miles from the nearest town. The town has a total population of 200-300. I could name 2 within driving distance that are having to buy new buildings to keep up with growth. Shhhhh don’t let anyone know…
They are dying whether or not you are willing to admit it. Pointing to a church or a few churches that are “growing” is not proof of the health of the IFB. Does your church have a name, and address? Would love to check it out.
You do know, the IFB started in the 1950′s? Any church that is 160 years old predates the IFB. (Like First Baptist in Hammond, an old church Hyles ripped out of the American Baptist Convention)
Besides, I know for a fact how most IFB churches “grow.” People change churches. IFB members are notorious for church hopping, always looking for the truer, truest, truth.
4,000 missionaries? The Mormon Church has 70,000 missionaries all over the world.
New colleges? You mean unaccredited, advanced Sunday Schools held in Church buildings.
Please give me a reference for your 22,000 church number.
The “truer, truest truth.” if I still believed in inspiration, I’d say that little phrase was inspired. Well put, indeed. Chasing after the Best Ear Ticklers might describe the same phenomenon, but your turn of phrase is more elegant and ironic. Keep swinging at those softballs, Bruce. It’s fun to watch you knock them over the fence.
Thanks, Rob.
Hey BRuce, looks like you allowed me back on the site. Thank you. The name of that little country church is the Round Prairie Baptist Church it is just outside Lockridge, IA. One of the Baptist distictives that sets all Baptists apart from other denominations is the autonomy of the local church, “Independent Baptist” or Southern Baptist or whatever. The idea of local autonomy predates the 50′s when the specific term may have been coined.
Forgot to tell you about my church. I pastor the Cornerstone Baptist Church in Vinton, IA. I have only been here for 18 months. The church has grown 110% in the last year. It is in a town of about 6,000 people. We genuinely seek to help people and make their lives better. You would be more then welcome to visit if you are willing to make the drive. We have purchased a new building and are refinishing it to suit our needs. The other church I referenced above is the Harvest Baptist Church in Oelwein, IA. They just started this church 1 year ago and they also just purchased a new building. I could name at least 3 other “IFB” churches that have started in Iowa in the last 6 months. I have named 3 churches and referenced 3 more. Can you name 6 “IFB” churches that have permenantly closed their doors in Iowa over the last couple of years? If some in the “IFB” movement are dying because they are dishonest or cultish then that is actually a good thing IMHO.
I am an Independent Baptist missionary in South America. It sounds like you were associated with IFB churches for a long time. I am very sorry for your negative feelings, thoughts, and judgments on the “movement”. Remember in your discourse though that while the “F” in the IFB is not much older than 100 years, the “I” is what is traceable through the ages back to the Founder of the New Testament church, Christ.
What I hear you saying Kyle is that your way, your Christian way is the right way, the original way and poor old Bruce just got on the wrong track. Sounds like you found the one true church. Pretty exciting eh?
Kyle,
You are kidding right? If not, I hope you will do a some reading about the history of Christianity. There is no line back to Christ, no pure, historic Christian (Baptist) church. Only by reading history with “Trail of Blood” glasses can one come to the conclusion you do.
Baptists had their beginning in the 17th century, 1700 years after Jesus.
Bruce,
When did I say that the “B” in IFB can be traced to Christ? You assume too much. I think your hatred blinds you.
What books on church history do you recommend that I read? I’ve read a lot of them. I recommend you read A History of the Baptists written by Thomas Armitage in 1890.
If you say that the independent Christian church cannot be traced back to its founder Jesus Christ, then you need to put down the catholic church history textbooks and dig a little deeper. I don’t care what kind of glasses you wear.
Kyle
In the IFB, the I and the B are intricately connected. To deny this flies in the face of the history of the movement.
I have read every major work on Baptist history. You have a truncated view of Christian Church history becuase you reject the predominant history (catholic) of the Christian church. One can not understand the history of the Christian church apart from Catholicism. You want to maintain that there as always been a line of independent churches through history. Not only does history not support this, neither does the Bible. (as the council at Jerusalem shows)
No hatred here, Kyle, just amusement and sadness. IFB churches and Colleges continue to teach young preachers a Baptist colored history that ignores the vast majority of the history of Christianity.
For amusement sake, please give the unbroken independent church lineage from Jesus to today. (and for extra fun try to explain how Jesus’s church and Paul’s church are one at the same)
Bruce,
There is no such thing as “the council at Jerusalem” in the Bible. You can put your Catholic title on what happened in Acts 15 if you want, but there was no papal authority there.
As far as the unbroken independent church lineage from Jesus to today, I cannot write on a blog what has had volumes written about it. I could explain to you the biblical philosophy of Christ’s church always existing, but since you have read “every major work” on the subject I guess you just already know everything to be said. So, I guess no amusement for you.
Now for the “extra fun”… Paul did not have a church. That is why he wrote, “And he (Christ) is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.” in Colossians 1:18. In Ephesians 5:23-27 Paul lays out clearly who the church belongs to (not himself). That’s why he said that if church’s tried to replace Christ with men like himself, Apollos, or Cephas (Peter) they were “yet carnal”.
Bruce, I am not going to continue going back and forth with you on your blog. You can call mocking my faith amusement and fun, but deep down in your heart I know that you are sure that you’ll have to face your Creator one day. Amos 4:12, “prepare to meet thy God”.
Kyle
So let’s see, the Bible proves that Baptists, Independent Baptists are the “true” church. NO proof outside of Ana-Baptist, Mennonite, Baptist, or Campbellite historians. (many of which are preachers masquerading as historians)
What amuses me is what actually saddens me. Your blindness and arrogance cuts you off from anyone and everyone that does not believe as you do. I am not mocking your faith. I AM challenging your truncated, incomplete reading of Christian church history. I know your position extremely well. I have read the source material, the same books you have read.
Remember you are the one who came to my blog. You chose to comment. I will make you an offer. Using Church history sources that are not Baptist and not quotes from the Bible, please make a case for the Independent Baptist church being the “true” church, the church founded by Jesus. I will, without edit, post your article on this blog.
As far as what I think (you see the Bible heart is the mind) in my heart, I am quite certain that I shall not meet your imaginary, creator God. I am quite certain that when I die I will meet decay. This blog post and our comments will fade into history having been of little or no significance. (in the grand scheme of things)
Your threat of God’s judgment has no effect on me. I gladly am a reprobate, beyond the reach of God’s grace. You can quote verse until Charles Spurgeon rises again from the dead and says Amen, it will make no difference. I am beyond the power of the “word” and the Holy Spirit as not been seen in ten years.
I do wonder about your quotes in your other comment? Are you a Calvinist like Spurgeon and many of the other old “true” Baptists? If not, and most Independent Baptists despise Calvinism, why embrace Spurgeon’s history but totally reject his soteriology?
Hi Kyle,
I concur with Bruce’s comments though I don’t have any experience of IFB churches.
Didn’t Baptist churches (not IFB ones) start in England in the !7th Century? Anabaptists in the 16th century? i studied at a Baptist seminary in Australia and they had a wad of books on church history and nowhere on their shelves was there anything about Baptists going back to Jesus Christ (or John the Baptist either).
I know of no historian who believes that baptist churches went back to Jesus in direct line, no matter which Baptist denomination you might refer to.
If the IFB churches go back in direct lineage to Jesus, then why is it that some of your pastors teach a top down model of power, with the Pastor as God’s man and with the Pastor’s view of the bible tending to be identified with God’s view? Why do some of your churches practise patriarchal power and deny women their human rights, when Jesus treated women with dignity?
Why do some of your pastors preach “violence” against children by teaching corporal punishment, when Jesus treated children with tenderness? I just don’t understand your denomination’s stance. Why is so much abuse occuring if it is truly led by the Spirit of the compassionate Jesus?
Shalom,
John Arthur
I meant to say Anabaptists in 16th century Switzerland, and in Gemany as well as Holland.
The commenter with likely say he never said Baptist. He believes Independent churches go all the way back to the church that Jesus established. Of course when quizzed about the doctrine and ecclesiology of the church that Jesus established….viola! the doctrine and ecclesiology is just like a Baptist church.
Modern Baptists can trace their lineage back to the 17th century. It is interesting that most 17th century Baptist churches were Calvinistic, a doctrinal system most IFB pastors despise.
The AnaBaptists? The IFB loves to claim them but IFB churches are hardly AnaBaptist. (the Mennonites are the children of the AnaBaptists)
Hi John,
Here are some quotes that barely scratch the surface. The anabaptists certainly did not start in the 16th century. As for the seminary that you went to… there are two types of Baptists: Protestant Baptists and Independent Baptists. The former trace their lineage to the reformation while the latter trace their lineage to Christ. If the seminary you went to was a Protestant Baptist school then they would not have had history books written from the Independent Baptist perspective.
These first two quotes are from Baptists, so they might not be as valuable to you. However, with very little digging, you can find that the Anabaptists did not start in the 16th century, and that there are plenty of historians who teach that Baptists are the original church.
“We believe that the Baptists are the original Christians. We did not commence our existence at the Reformation, we were reformers before Luther or Calvin were born; we never came from the Church of Rome, for we were never in it, but we have an unbroken line up to the apostles themselves. We have always existed from the very days of Christ, and our principles, sometimes veiled and forgotten, like a river which may travel underground for a little season, have always had honest and holy adherents. Persecuted alike by Romanists and Protestants of almost every sect, yet there has never existed a government holding Baptist principles which persecuted others; nor; I believe, any body of Baptists ever held it to be right to put the consciences of others under the control of man. We have ever been ready to suffer; as our martyrologies will prove, but we are not ready to accept any help from the State, to prostitute the purity of the Bride of Christ to any alliance with Government, and we will never make the Church, the despot over the consciences of men.” Charles Spurgeon
“I have no question in my own mind that there has been a historical succession of Baptists from the days of Christ to the present.” John T. Christian, college professor, historian, author
“Of the Baptists it may be said that they are not reformers. These people, comprising bodies of Christian believers known under various names in different countries, are entirely distinct and independent of the Roman and Greek churches, have had an unbroken continuity of existence from Apostolic days down through the centuries.” King, Crossing the Centuries, 1912
“The institution of Anabaptism is no novelty, but for 1300 years has caused great disturbance in the church…” Ulrich Zwingli, Swiss Reformer (1484-1531)
“… as early as the 3rd century AD the apostate Church opposed the anabaptists.” .Henry Bullinger (1504- 1575), Protestant Swiss reformer
“Clouds of witnesses attest the fact that before the…papery, and from the Apostolic age to the present time, the sentiments of Baptists, and the practice of baptism has had a continued chain of advocates, and public monuments of their existence in every century can be produced.” Alexander Campbell,Church of Christ
“We have now seen that the Baptists, who were formerly called Anabaptists, and in later times, Mennonites, were the original Waldenses… On this account, the Baptists may be considered as the only religious community which has stood since the days of the apostles, and as a Christian society which has preserved pure the doctrines of the gospel through all ages.” Ypeij and Dermout,(1819) royal historians to the king of Holland
“I should not readily admit that there was a Baptist Church as far back as AD 100, although without doubt there were Baptists then, as all Christians were then Baptists.” John Ridpath,(1840-1900) Methodist historian
“Baptists can be traced to 618 A.D. and it is presumed that they originate from the original source of the churches.” Rev. E. W. Gotch, Ency. Brit.
As for your other questions concerning women’s rights, corporal punishment for children, etc… those will have to wait for another time. I have already spent too much time on this blog. If you post your email address, then I would be glad to discuss anything you’d like. I’ll be sure to check back for any follow up comment in case you put your email. God bless you.
Kyle
Ah yes, Baptists, Mennonites, Ana-Baptists, and Campbellites (who were Baptists before they were excommunicated) all saying we are the true Church of Christ. No different than the Catholic church. Please point us to Christian church historians, outside of Baptist historians, who make this claim?
Your a-historical view requires a careful reading of 2000 years of Christian church history that ignores any history that does not fit your Landmark history.
Exactly what i was thinking Bruce. I remember the “Trail of Blood”, I read it & it was believed by a lot of folks in the cult I left like it was another extension of God’s truth. It seems that booklet was not written based on historical facts, but to try to twist history to fit the predetermined religious dogma of the writer.
My guess is that all roads lead to Rome as far as Christianity goes…but the sects that fragmented from the Catholic church don’t want to acknowledge that, so they have tried to create an alternate reality – & the Trail of blood is one attempt to do that, among many. my pithy .02
Hi Kyle,
It is no use quoting Spurgeon (a preacher) nor Zwingli (another preacher).. They were not church historians nor could they ever have access to modern scholarship on church history since they died long ago.
I notice you do not refer to any analyses by modern Church historians that publisn in scholarly academic journals who have undertaken recent historical research on church history.
So your response in utterly inadequate and your point that independent Baptists go back to Jesus Christ lacks credibility. Please show me the evidence!
Shalom,
John Arthur
I just left my IFB church after seven years. I struggled to stay in this Church, but I did not feel God calling me out of there until a few weeks ago.
Today I know that I am saved and that I will always be saved. Most Christians Churches will not go near this topic. I believe that God has planted me in a new Church so that I can present God’s plan for our salvation correctly to the many Christians who are trying to work their way into heaven. I do this in a loving and gentle way. I don’t thump my Bible, holler, work up a sweat, scare people, AND, (most importantly) I am willing to build a long-term relationship with others in order to point them to Christ. I am not, and never will be, a “turn or burn” person. I love others way too much to do that to them.
I do not regret the time I spent in the IFB Church, but it was a stepping stone for me. I’m sure my Pastor’s wife thinks I am going straight to Hell, but that’s her problem.
So you are the “real” Christian. Good to know.
you are a mean person
And WHY am I mean?
I simply pointed out that Jeanette thinks she is THE real Christian who must help those in her new church to find the real salvation that she has.
Just a straight forward, accurate observation.
If you think this is mean…well..you ain’t seen mean.