Recently, it became known that Robert Morris, an Evangelical megachurch pastor, repeatedly sexually assaulted a twelve-year-old girl. Morris was twenty-one when he began abusing the girl. The abuse continued for several years. Morris admitted sexually assaulting the pre-teen girl.
No criminal charges were filed against Morris, or the church — who knew about Morris’ crimes and swept them under the proverbial rug. The girl’s father did the same, thinking the church would properly and sufficiently deal with the matter. After a short hiatus from preaching, Morris returned to preaching.
Dr. David Tee, who has never met an Evangelical sexual predator he didn’t like or couldn’t defend, had this to say about Morris’ crimes:
It seems this sinful ideology and activity has raised its head once again. Since BG [Bruce Gerencser] mentioned he was expecting us to write about this situation, we decided to take another look at it. Originally we weren’t going to but before we get too far into this topic, we will state that the only side we are taking is the side of Justice.
We have no dog in this fight but we are concerned that people are going over the top in their revenge for things that happened far too long ago. What is happening is not justice but more vigilantism and a kangaroo court style of justice that permeates the @MeToo and @MeChurch totalitarian activities.
….
As we have read the articles, no mention of any real evidence has been discussed. We have another man attacked merely on the word of a woman on an event that took place over 40 years ago. memories can be good but memories are not evidence.
And you need real, credible, and verifiable evidence as well as the truth before justice can be done. The Bible talks about this on several occasions where the king demanded the truth not someone’s word. If women want their word to be believed, then produce real, credible, and verifiable evidence.
….
Here is the other problem. if this sin was dealt with, and it does not matter about the age of the victim, then the woman has no legal or spiritual ground to stand on. Since she was a minor her father acted on her behalf and the matter was settled.
She does not have the right to dredge up this old act as it was dealt with 40 years ago. The Pastor accepted the conditions and fulfilled them so there is no case here. It sounds like someone has been talking to the woman to get her to repudiate the earlier agreement and go after deep pockets.
We have been told this pastor is worth millions, thus, a money grab by the woman is not out of the question. if we are going to take the woman’s word at face value, then to avoid hypocrisy and other negative aspects, we must take the Pastor’s word at face value and accept that he has not committed these or other crimes again.
If she does not present real evidence, then neither does he, although his claim is easier to find evidence to support it than hers.
….
Here is another problem with this situation. Defining the term ‘abuse’ and ‘abusing’ is difficult as most definitions are subjective and are heavily influenced by emotion as well as the age of the alleged victim.
What is considered abuse and abusing someone varies and the application of those terms is distorted in hopes of producing the desired result. Honesty has long disappeared from cases where ‘sexual abuse’ and children are involved.
Plus, time has a way olf affecting people’s perceptions of these situations. What was once considered not abuse by either party is often changed over time to reflect a more modern perspective. But justice does not depend on how actions are viewed today for crimes committed in another era or century.
Justice has to determine if the alleged actions were truly abuse or not. Since neither party provides private and intimate details of the encounters but wraps them up in a generalized category labeled abuse, we cannot determine the truth of the matter.
If it wasn’t for the fact that the Pastor admitted to this activity, this would merely be a he said, she said case. Without proper evidence, no one will know the truth. if one wants to apply double jeopardy laws to this case, the woman is demanding that the PAstor pay twice for the same alleged crime.
That is neither right nor justice.
Got all that?
Worse, Tee, whose real name is Derrick Thomas Thiessen, went on to say:
The age of the woman at the time of the alleged crime does not matter. Nor should it influence how people view this sin. Since the Pastor did not engage in this activity continuously, it is unfair and unjust to label him a pedophile.
The issue that influences this case is the concept of when childhood ends and adulthood begins. Society in general has added another 7 years to ‘childhood’ and called them teen years. While technically correct, there is no biblical support for this extension of childhood.
It is a disservice to our young people by forcing them to remain children delaying their ability to grow up properly and become responsible adults. This faulty extension does not mean a crime was not committed, it just means that justice will be distorted as people are wrongfully influenced.
If we had better views of life and let our children become adults at the right time, justice would be better served.
That’s right, Thiessen said the age of the girl was immaterial. According to Thiessen, just because Morris repeatedly assaulted the girl doesn’t mean he’s a pedophile. He was what, then, a poor misguided man who couldn’t keep himself from putting his hands on the girl’s private parts? In Thiessen’s addled mind, if only this girl had been older — no harm, no foul.
Thiessen seems to think that the matter has been dealt with; that the church and her father acted on her behalf — end of discussion. Thiessen thinks clergy sex crimes should be handled in-house instead of being reported to law enforcement. Let “God” clean up the crimes of preachers, right?
In the end, Thiessen blames the victim, accusing her of being an opportunist:
We have been told this pastor is worth millions, thus, a money grab by the woman is not out of the question.
….
If this situation continued for 4 1/2 years why did she let it go on for so long? The pastor held no power to harm her or her family so why did she participate for this length of time?
If everyone wants justice, then her thoughts and actions must be considered and examined. She can’t willingly participate for 4 1/2 years then 40 years later call it a crime and abuse. Why did she not tell her parents for this length of time?
Explain to me how an alleged follower of Jesus can think this way? Thiessen will say I misquoted him or took his words out of context, I will leave it to you to decide if I have misrepresented him in any way. (Please see Dr. David Tee Says It is Wrong for Me to Write the Black Collar Crime Series and Christians Say the Darnedest Things: “Dr.” David Tee Continues to Whine About the Black Collar Crime Series.)
Thiessen says a lot of crazy shit, but his defense of sexual predators is beyond the pale. I have a few ideas about why this is so, but it is best if I leave them unstated.
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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Tee is a truly disgusting individual with absolutely no moral compass. To defend the actions of this pastor is grotesque. Why should he be criminally excused when it’s stated as a fact that he never previously faced criminal sanctions? Why should the passage of time provide him with immunity? The court can hear the evidence and if it’s not satisfied that the case is proved then the pastor is found not guilty, but it’s not for Tee to prejudge or second guess it. And his efforts to try and reclassify a 12 year old girl as an adult is shocking. I continue to wonder as to his underlying motives.
It’s also ironic how he keeps referring to the need for good evidence to be able to try this case. He’s always complaining that evidence isn’t important to faith, and yet that the bible is full of evidence. He’s a nutcase on steroids who isn’t able to stand in a mirror and truly reflect.
Sadly, I agree. I was an Evangelical for 50 years. I’ve never met a Christian like him. Well, besides Revival Fires and Elliot, that is. 🤬🤬😢😢
Just more of Tee’s tortured reasoning. Not really worth the effort to refute him. I will say this. She does have the right to redress if the law says so. Bible thumpers have no say about it unless they are also judges. Bible thumpers on the bench do unfortunately have the last say.
I fear the statute of limitations will save this preacher’s pathetic ass. I hope she sues not only Morris, but the church.
It will. The abuse occurred in Oklahoma in the 1980s, and it is beyond the statute of limitations to sue or for criminal prosecution of sexual abuse. Oklahoma has since expanded the time period in for criminal prosecution of sexual abuse, but it was not made retroactive.
Thanks for the legal update. ❤️
And Tee responds. Defend, deflect, accuse. Same shit, new day.
https://theologyarchaeology.wordpress.com/2024/06/20/mechurch-2/
Unfortunately, Dr. Tee’s comments aren’t unusual or uncommon in this situation, despite the fact he’s totally wrong. The woman Morris abused was afraid to come forward at the time, as are many victims. The woman Morris abused also stated her parents agreed he should never serve as a pastor again. Tee forgets Morris not only sinned, he committed crimes against his victim, and it is too late for her to sue. She carried a lot of shame around which was not hers, but her abuser’s shame.
Morris’s son will be the new Gateway Church pastor, so I am sure Morris will continue to have some influence behind the scenes. In addition, I would not be surprised if he abused other girls.
I have no doubt that Morris has NOT preached his last sermon. I also think it’s likely that there are more secrets in Morris’ closet. Rarely are these things a one off. Possible, but not likely. 😢
Lord it is that girl woman you gave me that made me sin.
How is a pubescent girl supposed to prevent a sexual assault from an adult male—especially if he is in a position of trust and authority? Oh, and in the time she mentions, the scales would have been tilted even more in his favor.
Why do you think it took me more than three decades to tell a therapist—and nearly another two to tell another human being, and to write (outside of a personal journal) about it?
By the way, I didn’t make a dime from it. And the Roman Catholic Church has much deeper pockets than any other congregation.
And don’t get me started on the former congregant of an Evangelical Church of which I was later a member. Decades after we moved, she told me about a deacon who raped her. If she had spoken up then, I’m sure someone like “Tee” would have defended him.
(I’ve written about my story and hers in previous guest posts as MJ Lisbeth.)
Hi MJ. I hear you. 🙁 Tee doesn’t know what he’s talking about (speaking to the choir.) How sad that he thinks he speaks with authority.
Just one comment Bruce:
SMDH – and these are the leaders the christian nationalists wish to place in positions of power and authority.
We are all screwed Bruce, if these maniacs elect trump, literally and figuratively.
I am outraged at Tee’s excuses. I can barely pull myself together enough to write a reputation. For him to move the goalposts on what is considered a child in order to condone the actions of a sexual abuser adult is beyond the pale of anything I have ever heard. And to say that this child, now reclassified as an adult by Tee based on his interpretation of texts written when children and females were male property, is at fault for not trying to defend herself from her abuser is a step beyond the previous beyond the pale classification. Tee is truly despicable. It isn’t as if we didn’t know that already, but this is incontrovertible evidence.
Exactly right, Obstaclechick, and I bet that this is one reason that Tee stays in Asia-where kids have no rights anyway.
Scum. DT is scum, period.
First thought is why in the world would you keep talking about this loser, Bruce? But then again, why not? The guy reveals how much of a shit show Christianity is, even better than any of us who’ve escaped it. So keep it up. The guy’s his own worst enemy.
I mean the whole response is beyond . . . but this makes me full-on sick.
This part here:
“The age of the woman at the time of the alleged crime does not matter. Nor should it influence how people view this sin. Since the Pastor did not engage in this activity continuously, it is unfair and unjust to label him a pedophile.
The issue that influences this case is the concept of when childhood ends and adulthood begins. Society in general has added another 7 years to ‘childhood’ and called them teen years. While technically correct, there is no biblical support for this extension of childhood.
It is a disservice to our young people by forcing them to remain children delaying their ability to grow up properly and become responsible adults. This faulty extension does not mean a crime was not committed, it just means that justice will be distorted as people are wrongfully influenced.
If we had better views of life and let our children become adults at the right time, justice would be better served.”
Zoe: What is he doing/saying? A 12 year old is not a girl? She’s an adult? It belongs under the heading of sin but no where near pedophilia?
He seems to be setting up a defense for sexually abusing a 12 year old. One wonders why? Why would he imply this whole diatribe about childhood and adulthood other than to set up the possibility of being sexually active with a 12 year old, simply being okay or “not that terrible”? I mean after all, the Bible doesn’t support such mumble jumble according to him. Sadly, I tend to think this has to do with Mary probably being 12 when the Holy Spirit got her pregnant. I mean if the Lord can prevail on Mary, why not? Can’t be that bad. God couldn’t be a pedophile.
Tee makes it sound like it was a one time thing. I think I read it was over a 5 year period of time. Is he seriously implying that once isn’t “that bad.” If not a pedophilia, then what label does Tee prefer? Did Morris’s actions transition to non-pedophilia at some point? If so, when? Age of 13? 14? 15? 16? Oh wait. Tee thinks 12 is not pedophilia. Unfair and unjust. Give me a break. How many other “not-pedophiles” &/or “sexually abusive” Christians are you protecting Tee? How many under that dusty old carpet of yours? Just keep sweeping, just keep sweeping. sigh
Justice? What the hell are you talking about Tee?
I have my suspicions about Thiessen. Why does he repeatedly protest the Black Collar Crime series? I’ve yet to see him write a post supporting or defending a victim/survivor. Instead, he resolutely defends miscreants such as Morris, Ravi Zacharias, Bill Cosby, Bill Gothard, and others. He says he seeks justice, but seems to ALWAYS seek Justice for perpetrators, and not their victims. At the very least, his sense of justice is warped.
The man doth protest too much, methinks.
The pastor I mentioned in one of my comments. He preached about adultery for 2 years straight. I finally said to my husband, this guy has a problem. Sure enough it was revealed.
He writes as though he is really setting up his own personal defense.
Greetings, Bruce. Yeah, I have the idea that one reason he won’t allow anyone to comment on his blog, is because someone would bring up this fact that as a practicing Christian, he is to come to the defense of children, the poor, orphans- yet he only lauds these wealthy idiots who got exposed in the media. He’s not up to a direct challenge, especially now. Most of the Western countries don’t legalize such things, where kids are concerned. Child betrothal, something that happens in the Middle E and India, though it’s less now, in recent years. It usually doesn’t occur in the West anymore( though some Fundie guys in Southern states ARE trying to make it legal). Tee’s perversity is really showing stronger lately, or is it me ?
Tee: “It seems this sinful ideology and activity has raised its head once again. Since BG [Bruce Gerencser] mentioned he was expecting us to write about this situation, we decided to take another look at it. Originally we weren’t going to but before we get too far into this topic, we will state that the only side we are taking is the side of Justice.
We have no dog in this fight but we are concerned that people are going over the top in their revenge for things that happened far too long ago. What is happening is not justice but more vigilantism and a kangaroo court style of justice that permeates the @MeToo and @MeChurch totalitarian activities.”
Zoe: “Sinful ideology.” Is that the new lingo for sexual abuse? Justice? Sorry, I can only laugh at you Tee. You do have a dog in this fight and you know it. You picked a side. Your concern is for Morris. Oh poor Morris, those terrible young girls he sinfully ideologized. Look Lord. She gave me the damn apple. It’s the girl that deceived me. You wreak of it Tee. You have no ideal what justice is. Justice is a pastor that keeps his grubby sized hands, and fingers off of a young girls body. Justice is a pastor that removes his stink away from a young innocent girl before he can penetrate her. Justice is a pastor who doesn’t return to the pulpit ever after this offense. I don’t care if he thinks, you think and the church thinks he can be forgiven or is forgiven. He should not be in a position of authority ever again. Ever.
Tee: “As we have read the articles, no mention of any real evidence has been discussed. We have another man attacked merely on the word of a woman on an event that took place over 40 years ago. memories can be good but memories are not evidence.
And you need real, credible, and verifiable evidence as well as the truth before justice can be done. The Bible talks about this on several occasions where the king demanded the truth not someone’s word. If women want their word to be believed, then produce real, credible, and verifiable evidence.”
Zoe: Who died and made you God Tee? Who? You sound like the pastor in a former church I attended that lied through his teeth about the sin that hovered all around his gonads. sigh You want evidence. You are a joke. Oh I know you don’t think so. I know you think you are a bag of chips and more. You poor soul and the poor people you lead in the name of Christ. I think God is not your God Tee. I think the Bible is your God and if so it is an idol that you worship. Time to burn it Tee. Repent.
Thiessen is the kind of guy that demands bloody sheets to prove a woman’s virginity.😢 He has been deeply influenced by Jack Hyles and others like him: if you didn’t see it, it didn’t happen.
Of course, there IS evidence for her claims. Her testimony, her parents’ testimonies, church staff testimonies, the testimony of a friend she told at the time, and, most of all, the fact that the church put him on leave for his actions. This is more than enough to convict him in a court of law, if not for the statute of limitations.
While it is possible for this to be a one-off, I suspect is law enforcement starts digging through is life they will find other crimes. Pedophiles rarely stop until they are caught.
Thiessen forgets or chooses to ignore the fact that this incident with Morris happened in the U.S., and pedophilia is STILL illegal here, I don’t know about the Philippines and child law there, but I do know that the kids there don’t have advocates like we do here. His dismissal of basic child safety, and the fact that these pervy pastors go for kids who are minors, whom HE claims are actually not- rather hints that if he had the chance, who knows what can happen there, overseas beyond U.S. laws……