Late nights are rough on me. Want to talk to me? Message or call me during the night, and I will likely be up. Why? Pain. Sure, I take pain medications and use cannabis, but all these wonder drugs do is lessen my pain, improving my quality of life. Due to widespread pain, especially neuropathic pain in my legs, I can rarely sleep more than two hours at a time. My therapist has worked with me so I don’t get frustrated and angry when I can’t sleep. She encourages me to go with the flow and sleep when I can. So, my nighttimes are quite fragmented. Typically, when I can’t sleep, I either listen to YouTube videos or podcasts. Of late, I have been listening to a lot of atheist debate call-in shows. Christians (and Muslims and Jews) are encouraged to call in and give evidence for the existence of God or the truthfulness of the Bible. What astounds me the most is how little many Evangelicals understand what the Bible teaches. More often than not, they are ill-prepared to:
But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear: having a good conscience; that, whereas they speak evil of you, as of evildoers, they may be ashamed that falsely accuse your good conversation in Christ. For it is better, if the will of God be so, that ye suffer for well doing, than for evil doing. (I Peter 3:15-17)
Lately, an Evangelical man named Stevie has been calling into these shows, making all sorts of unsupported claims about Christianity and the Bible. Recently, Stevie argued that all four gospels were written before the fall of Jerusalem in 70 CE, and the Dead Sea Scrolls contain New Testament verses. Really? New Testament verses in the Dead Sea Scrolls? Do tell.
Unfortunately, none of the hosts challenged Stevie’s assertion about the Dead Sea Scrolls. Had they been better versed on the Bible, they could have told Stevie that the Dead Sea Scrolls do NOT contain ANY verses from the New Testament.
Object? Here’s what the Christian site LOGOS has to say about this claim:
A few scholars early in the study of the Dead Sea Scrolls suggested that some very small Greek fragments from Qumran were copies of New Testament books, but this idea was quickly debunked as the full contents of the collection became known and the manuscripts were more closely studied. There were no Christian texts discovered at Qumran or elsewhere among the Dead Sea Scrolls, nor is there any direct evidence of contact between the Qumran community and the early Jesus movement. Nevertheless, the Dead Sea Scrolls provide important background information and textual parallels that have helped scholars understand the New Testament better in light of its first century A.D. Judean context.
So much for Stevie’s claim. This is why when we are interacting with Evangelical apologists we should ALWAYS ask them for evidence for their claims. Don’t let them get by with prooftexting and bullshitting. After all, Evangelicals are duty bound to give an answer to every man that asketh them a reason of the hope that is in them.
Bruce Gerencser, 68, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 47 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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I think it takes someone with your level of Bible knowledge, Bruce, to really be effective in discussions of this sort. I know the Bible better than most people, but not remotely at your level. I say this only because I’m often disappointed by the lack of knowledge “atheists” (it always sounds like a fraternal order) evidence in debates. Of course, keeping up with the arguments is both an endless project and endlessly entertaining. I especially like Bart Ehrman’s take on things, in print, and Bart and Dan McClellan on Youtube. And of course your writing. Wish you had had the opportunity to put your story from your blogs into a book. Tee could write the preface.
I need to study this in greater depth, but reading a bit on the Dead Sea Scrolls, it seemed to me that John the Baptist might have been an Essene, and that his execution might have left a void filled by a follower of his, Jesus. This would explain to me why Jesus would burst on the scene at age 29 or so. Luke’s nativity stories could indicate the need of the author to put John in a subordinate position to Jesus.
Wish you weren’t in pain. Take care.
When fundy, I imagined the original versions of my beloved bible manuscripts were discovered on parchment scrolls which had been lovingly preserved in pristine condition. Not so, they were subject to mould, to decay and those who put the fragments together, said it was like doing a 10,000 piece jigsaw without references. Scribes guessed missing words or if damp had obscured them. Some might alter the meaning if a verse gave favour to a female! When 2 valiant victorian sisters went to the Sinai peninsula and began to seek ways to collect fragments of scripture, local scammers forged some and aged them to look authentic and sold them to gullible explorers. The 2 victorian women in their long skirts, climbed ladders to scavenge through heaps and heaps of document fragments in jewish Genizahs there I recommend a book, Sisters of Sinai, by J Soskice which is where this information – and much more, is from.
I had a naive view too, albeit different from yours. I thought that somehow some way God supernaturally preserved the manuscripts, giving us the perfect Word of God. This ran contrary to what I knew about the manuscripts, translation, and the history of the texts, but I pushed these things aside do I could maintain the Bible was the perfects words of the thrice holy God. Later in my ministerial career, I had to admit I couldn’t rationally sustain my beliefs about the Bible. Unfortunately, I never told church members that. I feared that if they learned the truth that they would have doubts or lose their faith. I didn’t want to be the reason for someone’s loss of faith. So, I lied, not directly, but by not giving them all the facts and information. The sin of omission, I suppose.
Bruce, just my opinion- I think you actually cared about your parishioners’ feelings and well being, which in large part depended on the certainty of their religious faith. That’s not a bad thing, to care for others’ psychological well being, even if that means you have to keep your own existential struggle internal and hidden.
Ultimately you developed the courage to accept what you knew about yourself, and today you are using the skills you developed as a Pastor to help a new “congregation” so to speak- your flock are people who have been disillusioned with conservative Christianity. If there is hope for our future, it is with people like you, who have the courage of conviction but who are also willing to correspond with folks who may not be 100% in solidarity but still can engage in respectful dialogue. This is the way we can all find a way to live with one another.
The folks who spend their time picking over the Dead Sea scrolls, or even better the Nag Hammadi texts in order to prove their 2000 year old religion to be somehow “valid” are grossly missing the point, in my humble opinion. The information gained from these ancient collections are interesting from a historical perspective, but that’s it for me. As I have said before, if you profess a religious faith, your best “proof” is showing that it is making you a better person, although I don’t think religion itself is the only path for self improvement. Show me your faith by your works (conduct), otherwise it is dead.