The Toledo Blade recently published a story about how some Amish and Mennonite communities expect victims of child abuse, domestic violence, and other crimes to forgive their attackers and forget the crimes ever happened. Practicing absolute forgiveness, these faith communities expect congregants to forgive regardless of what harm is caused and whether perpetrators are truly sorry for their crimes. The Toledo Blade story focuses on a woman who was excommunicated from her conservative Mennonite church because she refused to forgive her husband — a man who repeatedly sexually molested their daughters over the years. Astoundingly, the Sunday after this woman was excommunicated, her church, with arms opened wide, welcomed her husband back into the church.
After local law enforcement became aware of the husband’s criminal sexual behavior, he confessed his “sins” and was sentenced to five years of probation and 15 years on Pennsylvania’s sex offender registry. You would think that the husband would be penitent and understand why his wife no longer wanted her children anywhere near him. Unfortunately, as is often the case with sex crimes that have a religious component, the husband didn’t truly see the depth of harm he caused:
They held a seminar, and they talked about how that is sin, and I did want to be free before God and confess it and get freedom, Shirk, now 50, said in an April interview. I didn’t want something hid that should have been confessed and taken care of.
I did confession in church and made the confession in church and everybody stood and said they forgave me. I thought it was all good, but I found out that doesn’t make everybody happy.
[He laughed.]
After that, I found out a lot of people carry a lot of hatred for that sin and it’s hard for people to forgive.
….
This got way out of hand. For a little bit of touching that I did wrong. I know that it can be a big emotional thing for the girl, and it can affect their life ever after and stuff like that, and I don’t want to belittle what I did.
“There is no forgiveness for one thing. The state has no forgiveness, and therefore the church has no forgiveness, because the state is on their case that they’ll put the preacher in jail if they don’t report it.
I believe what they’re [the state] doing to men is way far worse. I mean, my daughters that I molested, yeah, as far as I know they are living a normal life. But I sure am not.
The husband continues to try to reconnect with his wife, saying:
I wouldn’t expect a woman to live with a man who is drunk and beating on her. I wouldn’t expect that. But when the church has gotten together and said this man [a convicted child molester] needs forgiveness, it would have been in her place to do that.
As you can see from the husband’s comments, he lacks remorse and contrition, and when it comes right down to it, he doesn’t think what he did is so bad. Hey, at least he didn’t beat his wife and the daughters he molested are living “normal” lives, right? The husband even went so far as to question his wife relationship with God, saying, “I just don’t understand how that [not being reconciled] is going to work out on Judgment Day.” The wife joined another conservative Mennonite church, and while she has been encouraged by them to reconcile with her husband, they have not pressed the matter with her. I am sure some readers are thinking, “WHAT THE FUCK! Why doesn’t she divorce her child-molester husband?” Well, the answer is quite simple: conservative Mennonite congregations do not permit divorce, and doing so would be immediate grounds for excommunication.
Generally, forgiving others is a good idea. Forgiveness fosters peace and helps reconcile people who are at odds with one another. However, practicing absolute forgiveness can and does cause harm, and as this story shows, it allows people to escape responsibility for their behavior. Our goal in life should be to live in ways that don’t require forgiveness, and when we do cause harm to someone, to quickly make amends or restitution. It is up to the person harmed, then, to grant forgiveness. Absolute forgiveness wrongly requires absolution regardless of whether the offender makes things right.
I saw this kind of forgiveness expectation practiced numerous times over the fifty years I spent in the Christian church. Private “sins” were expiated simply by the penitent confessing their bad behavior to God. The Bible says in 1 John 1:9: If we [Christians] confess our sins, he [God] is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. God promises to cleanse Christians from any and all sin if they will but ask him to do so. And if Christian’s ask, God wipes their sin slates clean, giving them the equivalent of a divine do-over. A sweet deal if you can get it, right?
When Christians commit public “sins” — behaviors that cause public shame to Jesus and his church — they are often brought before congregational leaders or fellow church members and expected to publicly confess their sins. Once the sinner has confessed his sins, he is absolved, and as in the case of private sins, his sin slate of wiped clean.
Whether a person is forgiven by Jesus of private or public sins, it matters not. Once forgiven — and exactly how is that determined? — congregants, including family, spouse, and children, are expected to absolutely forgive the person. Failing to do so is seen as bitterness or pride. I know of several instances where husbands abused their wives, confessed their “sins” before the church, and were granted forgiveness. Their wives were expected to forgive them and move on with life, living with men who just weeks before physically and psychologically abused them. In at least two instances that I know of, abusive husbands were welcomed back into their churches, while their wives were excommunicated for having bitter, judgmental spirits.
Even heinous crimes such as sexual abuse and rape are far too often covered over with expectations of absolute forgiveness. A recent story in the Houston Chronicle revealed that there are dozens of Southern Baptist churches who welcomed sex offenders back into their membership after their convictions. These churches KNEW these men were sex offenders, yet with arms open wide, they said, We forgive you, brother. Welcome to our church. I saw this same behavior on several occasions with Independent Fundamentalist Baptist (IFB) churches. One man, a church bus worker, was caught sexually abusing a teen boy in the church’s basement. He was forgiven by the church and escaped jail time for his crime. Twenty years later, the man was given access to children again, and as sure as the sun comes up in the morning, he sexually abused another child. This time, the man did time for his crime. While the church forgave him, they would not permit him to continue attending their services. With the blessing of his pastor and church leaders, the man joined a nearby IFB church, and to this day can be found there “faithfully” serving Jesus. Astoundingly, his wife — taught by her pastors that there are no grounds for divorce — is still with him.
Whether to forgive should be up to the person harmed. While forgiving others is generally a good idea, churches that demand forgiveness in all circumstances cause harm to people who cannot or are not ready to do so. The act of forgiveness rests with the person harmed. In the case of spousal abuse, child abuse, and sex crimes, churches which demand that victims absolutely forgive their attackers often revictimize and inflict further pain on women and children (and in some instances, men). Victims must be given the space to process what happened to them on their own terms. And if they, for some reason, cannot or will not absolve abusers of their crimes, churches and pastors should accept their decision.
I grew up in a religious culture where absolute forgiveness was expected, regardless of the seriousness of the bad behavior or crime. One of the freeing moments of my life was realizing that I didn’t have to forgive my grandparents (my mother’s father and stepmother) for what they did to me personally, and to my mother and our family in general. My grandparents were go-to-church-three-times-a-week Fundamentalist Christians. Grandpa was a violent drunk before he got saved. After asking Jesus to forgive him of his sins, Grandpa was transformed into a “wonderful” Christian who still was quite violent. And Grandma was not without her own demons. (Please see Dear Ann) Publicly, they were viewed by others as super-duper Christians who loved Jesus with all their heart, soul, and mind. And maybe they did, but underneath their religious veneer lived people prone to psychological and physical abuse.
Years before my mother’s tragic suicide (Please see Barbara), she tried to confront her dad over him sexually abusing her as a child. He told my mom that his past had been forgiven by Jesus and his sins were washed away by the blood of Jesus. He intimated to Mom that if Jesus had forgiven him, so should she. Needless to say, Mom was in no mood to forgive her child molester father. Nor did she plan to forgive his wife, a woman who caused untold heartache and pain. Years later, I reached a place where I had enough of my grandparents’ passive-aggressive behavior. I made it known that I was no longer interested in having a relationship with them. And with that, my grandparents were excised from my life and that of my family. Or so I thought anyway.
In 2003, I moved to Clare, Michigan and became the pastor of a small, struggling Southern Baptist church. One Sunday, as I was preaching, I glanced up and looked out the windows at the back of the building. I was shocked to see my grandmother sitting in her car with her new husband. (Grandpa had miserably died several years before of colon cancer.) I had a Christian version of a WTF moment, and sure enough, after the service my grandmother came up to me as if nothing had ever happened and told me she was living near me with her new hubby and asked if my family and I wanted to have dinner with them sometime. At that moment, I was dying inside, wanting to verbally reduce her to the pile of shit she was. Unfortunately, congregants were standing nearby, so I said, “sure.” Always play the part, Bruce. Always play the part. Several church members told me that they used to attend church with my grandmother. She is a wonderful Christian woman, they said. I responded, there are two sides to every story. Later, I would feel guilty over not forgiving her, so I spent time in prayer asking God to forgive me for being angry and bitter towards my grandmother.
Cleansed of my “sin,” I decided to try to forge a new relationship with my grandmother and her new husband. Polly dreaded doing so, remembering how awful my grandparents were towards her and our children. I played the “what would Jesus do” card, and off to my grandmother’s home we went — which was, ironically, a mile or so away from our home. During our dinner discussion, my grandmother decided to share a family secret that had laid buried for over fifty years: that my father was not my biological father. Granted, I had begun to question my paternity, and have since concluded that my “real” father was likely my mother’s cousin, but it was not my grandmother’s place to share this secret over dinner and in the presence of my wife and children. Why she decided to do this, I’ll never know. This was the last time I ever talked to her. Several months later, we moved back to Ohio, and outside of my grandmother trying to contact me on Facebook, I have had no contact with her. I sent her my Dear Ann article. She never responded. Of course not, it is all under the blood, buried in the deepest seas, never to be remembered again.
As an atheist and a humanist, I have learned that it is okay to not forgive some people; that some people, such as my grandparents, don’t deserve forgiveness; that them going to their graves unforgiven is just punishment for their crimes and ill-behavior. When my grandfather died, I felt nothing and shed not a tear. I was faulted for not attending his funeral, but I didn’t care. I knew it would be an act of Fundamentalist masturbation over his rotting corpse. I would hear wonderful tales about the man, the myth, the legend; the soulwinner who daily sought to evangelize the lost; the man who loved Jesus more than the world. We would not be told, as Paul Harvey used to say, “the rest of the story.”
I am fine with people thinking I am unforgiving; that I should make peace with my grandparents. My grandparents are bad people. No matter how many times they attended church, sang hymns, won souls, and gave money to the church, they were still, at least to family, nasty, judgmental, mean, and violent; guilty of behavior that would land them in jail if they did these things today. Life is too short to spend it around such people. If they need forgiveness, let them ask God for it. As their grandson and the son of the dear woman they physically and psychologically brutalized, I have no intention of granting them pardon. My grandfather is dead. Good riddance. Soon, my grandmother will meet her end too. I shall not weep, except, perhaps, for those harmed by their behavior. Too bad there’s not a Hell. If there were, I know two people who deserve first-class accommodations.
Were you taught that you must, in all circumstances, absolutely forgive? Please share your experiences in the comment section.
About Bruce Gerencser
Bruce Gerencser, 62, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 41 years. He and his wife have six grown children and twelve grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist. For more information about Bruce, please read the About page.
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Hi Bruce. I hardly know what to say. For some odd and briefly mysterious reason, after finishing my reading of your main blog post, my brain cells immediately transported me to a surreal moment in my life that occurred one afternoon in one of the rare—and I do mean rare—moments when I was listening to a conservative talk radio show where listeners could call in to the radio station and express their opinions on the subject of the day.
That radio station was in Knoxville, Tennessee. Best I can recall, the subject that day was President Obama, Africa, and African-American slavery in the United States. The radio host had just explained that the continent of Africa was the long ago ancestral home of most African-American citizens in the United States today. A few nations in Africa were mentioned, and the radio host included the nation of Niger and pointed out the fact that the nation is named after the Niger River, which flows either through the country or along side of it. After saying a few more words about slave ships, 18th and 19th century slavery in the United States, Jim Crow, and racism against African-Americans, the radio host opened up the citizen caller lines so listeners could call in and make comments on the subject under discussion.
Several calls were taken in quick succession, and then came one of the truly unforgettable moments of my life. The radio host picked up the telephone and a classic southern redneck “Bubba” with long, slow, drawn out pronunciations of words was on the other end of the line. It went like this—but very slowly. Scout’s honor:
Bubba: “That thang you just said.”
Radio Host: “What thing?”
Bubba: “Bout that there country in Africa. You called it “Niger.”
Radio Host: “Yes sir. What about it?”
Bubba: “Do you mean to tell me that Africa really has a river them black people named “Niger River”?
Radio Host: Ye-s-s-s-s-s?
Bubba: “And there’s a whole big country in Africa and them black people is named their whole, big country “Niger.”
Radio Host: “That’s what the map of Africa right here in front of me says.”
Bubba: (Huge Light Bulb Comes on in Bubba’s Head.) Long pause……
Radio Host: “You still there?????”
Bubba: “Well, don’t you see? It’s plain as day?”
Radio Host: “What?”
Bubba: “You really don’t see it????? They has a river they named Niger. They even named their country and river after themselves. You see!!!! EVEN—THEY—KNOW—WHAT—THEY—REALLY— ARE!!!!! NIGG…s!!!!
Radio Host: (Longest Period of Dumbfounded Radio Host Silence I Have Ever Heard…and then…the dial tone sound)
I sat there in front of my radio—-frozen still like an ice cube—with my mouth hanging wide open. I was sure the radio host was doing the same in front of his microphone.
Why did that actual incident come to mind after reading Bruce’s main post? Thinking it really weird, I stepped back for a few minutes and thought deeply about it—and then it hit me like a ton of bricks.
Bruce’s IFB church audience today is always trying to figure out how a great and highly faithful fundie pastor of 25 years could become an atheist. Apparently, from Bruce’s extensive writings, they have tried—and exhausted—every BS fundie explanation possible on planet Earth—and still have not solved the great mystery that dumbfounds them day-in and day-out with regard to Bruce and his current spiritual condition. I’ll let Bubba give you his hypothesis:
Bubba: “My laht bub * has cum own. Bruce was never a “true” Christian lock me ’cause heezuns wuz the product of FORNICATIVE INCEST—like most members of my own famly what don’t go to any church. Don’t ya see!!!!!?????? From the mowmint when that there cousin sperm squiggled through that there wall of the egg sale, the Bruce embryo soul was damned to Hayul by Satan his own seff—jist lock the members of my own famly wuz.”
I thought Bruce and you other folks might enjoy some real life humor from the Southern Mountains of East Tennessee. I moved here 45 years ago to study anthropology, and the local mountain culture and all of its subcultures never cease to amaze me—and yes—I know how to speak the local language after many years of close listening and learning—like from an experience I had one afternoon in the Meat Department at my local Kroger Supermarket. I had always thought that “back air” was a fart. A female meat cutter kept saying “back air,” over and over again, and I could not understand why she was screaming it out to another employee who was sifting around for something in the meat cutting and storage area behind the meat counter area. I only finally understood when she started using other forms of this terminology:
up air
down air
over air
in air
out air
She was actually saying “back there” to a fellow employee who was trying to find something that had gone missing.
Much love to you Bruce and friends—and have a happy day!!!
* We don’t use “light bulbs” here in East Tennessee. We use “laht bubs.”
Charles, “back air” is perfectly comprehensible to someone who grew up in upstate South Carolina. We got “laht bubs” here, too. No Krogers, though. We’d see Kroger in Knoxville when we were passing through on our way to my grandparents’ in Kentucky. I thought Kroger rhymed with Roger when I was little. As a reminder of those days, I bought a See Rock City birdhouse for my yard. Those were good times: herding the cows, playing ball in Cow Pile Stadium, playing in the hay loft, hunting for arrowheads…
I wa taught that we should always forgive, that it’s only up to God to judge. I didn’t follow that though, even during my fundy days. I figured, let God judge us both.
If someone abuses my children, not only will I not forgive them, but I would probably want to go after them…..
I believe the “forgive and forget” messages in Christianity are inherently harmful. Don’t get me wrong, there are times to forgive when someone is truly repentant. However why is there so much sex abuse in churches? Why is there more pressure for those who have been abused to forgive then for abusers to repent or make things right? Christianity ignores the reality of those without consciences too, and malignant narcissists and sociopaths. If anything all the pressure to forgive enables the evil.
https://fivehundredpoundpeeps.blogspot.com/2019/03/forgive-and-forget-enables-them.html
“We are in a society that overall encourages narcissism. People who are kind and loving and gentle are vilified. I often think about that when I think about how abused people are shamed and told they must “do right by their abusers”, isn’t that what the constant pressure to forgive is about? It’s in religion and it’s in the mental health field. Why does it seem to be a greater “sin” in these circles to not forgive even then the original abuse done by the abuser? Why isn’t it enough for someone to simply to continue living their life and leave the abusers in the rear view mirror of life?”
I got tired of being told in Christianity to give place to bad people who were going to stay bad no matter what. It’s one reason I deconverted.
Supposedly, forgiving your abuser is part of healing from the abuse. I have my doubts, especially when forgiveness is demanded. You can’t demand forgiveness, it’s not really forgiveness then! it’s merely a coerced statement of what exactly?
I was bullied as a kid. I was mercilessly picked on. I’ve forgiven them in my head, but I haven’t forgotten and I’d never tell them that I forgave them…it would be meaningless anyway.
I noticed long ago, they put more onus on the abused to forgive then on the abusers to stop abusing. I don’t believe abused people have to forgive abusers, especially sociopath/malignant narcissistic and other toxic ones. Don’t seek revenge and go get your own life and go no contact, but Christianity’s demand you go simpering and forgiving to your abuser, usually ensures more abuse especially in toxic people who don’t care who they hurt.
I have to admit that I struggle with bitterness as a Christian – especially after my divorce from my wife whose father just so happened to be a fundamentalist pastor. He was one of these men who said that there was absolutely no allowances for divorce – even adultery. (For all of his knowledge of Greek and Hebrew, apparently, he didn’t read that part.) He did not even allow his daughter to divorce his POS son in law for molesting 4 different girls in his Christian School Class. Apparently, when my wife left me (I did not want the divorce but I refused to be manipulated by the family any longer), he allowed her older sister to divorce the POS so that he could allow her to leave and make no attempt at reconciliation. As far as I was concerned, that made him a liar and a hypocrite. I have chosen to live by what the Bible (for all the fundamentalists out there) says: “If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men” (Romans 12:18) So I agree with you, Bruce, even if I choose to forgive, I don’t have to associate with them or have them in my life. As always, love your stuff! Even though I am a believer, I do find myself agreeing with you more than I disagreeing with you – especially when you tell the war stories!
Hi Mike. Excellent post. I am a Christian too. I like to read Bruce’s posts and the comments of his readers.
One of my liberal Christian acquaintances on-line often refers to atheists as the Quality Control Managers for the Christian faith. I suppose that from the atheist position, one could argue that all of the Christian faith is bullshit. I do not feel that way—but I do know one thing for certain as a professional anthropologist (with a strong background in archaeology, geology, and paleontology). The Christian faith, as we know it today, has been loaded down with so much sociocultural bullshit over the past 2,000 years that it would take an army of archaeologists with shovels to remove all of the bullshit from it so one can see the central kernel of love, beauty, peace, and warmth that has been buried under it for so long. I think that is what my acquaintance meant by atheists being Quality Control Managers for the Christian faith. They help to shovel the bullshit away so that the true essence of the Christian faith and its value to human beings can at last be seen.
For example, on the subject of forgiveness, I believe Jesus wants us to do that. If a rattlesnake bites me and I survive intact, I can forgive a rattlesnake because biting people when they feel threatened is just what rattlesnakes do. However, knowing that biting is what they do, my offered forgiveness does not obligate me to sleep in bed with a free roaming rattlesnake. Yes, the rattlesnake is forgiven, but after that one bite, I know to keep a healthy distance from rattlesnakes—just as you could forgive the person who abuses your child in church—you are not obligated to put your child or any other child near the mitts of that child-abusing rattlesnake—because we know what child abusers do and we know that most of them cannot help doing it because of severe underlying psychological disturbances from their own childhood turmoils.
Thanks for commenting, Mike. I saw too much pain and damage to not allow for divorce in my worldview, even if this meant I had to ignore certain Bible verses.