Every year or two, I ask readers to submit questions they want me to answer. That time has arrived once again. Any question. Any subject. Please leave your questions in the comment section or send them to me via email. I will try to answer them in the order received.
I look forward to reading and answering your questions.
The Black Collar Crime Series relies on public news stories and publicly available information for its content. If any incorrect information is found, please contact Bruce Gerencser. Nothing in this post should be construed as an accusation of guilt. Those accused of crimes are innocent until proven guilty.
Vernon Williamson, a former associate pastor at Assembly of the Body of Christ (the church is defunct) in Jacksonville, Florida, was recently sentenced to life in prison on four counts of sexual battery. Williamson’s fellow pastors, Paul Dyal and Jerome Teschendorf were arrested on similar charges and await trial. These men are 87, 80, and 70, respectively. According to news reports, their alleged crimes date back to the 1970s.
The Florida Times-Union reports:
In the first of three sexual assault cases against a pastor and two associates charged with offenses that began in the 1970s at a Jacksonville church, Vernon Lavern Williamson was found guilty Thursday and sentenced to life in prison.
Williamson, now 87, was arrested in Oklahoma and charged with four counts of sexual battery in March 2022. It followed a raid at the Jacksonville Assembly of the Body of Christ on Old Kings Road, where the pastor, 80-year-old Paul Brady Dyal, was jailed and charged with capital sexual battery on a child 11 or younger, according to the Sheriff’s Office.
In addition to Williamson, authorities also arrested Jerome Teschendorf, 70, on related capital sexual battery charges in Oklahoma. Both Dyal and Teschendorf are awaiting trial.
The ages of the children were redacted in arrest documents, but an information report cites they were younger than 12. Williamson’s arrest report says he was living on the church’s property at the time. One girl who came forward as an adult said her mother left her in his care when the sexual abuse occurred.
She reported it to the Sheriff’s Office in 2008 and told investigators she disclosed the incidents to the pastor, Dyal, in 2004. Williamson denied the allegations, and Dyal told investigators he didn’t believe the child at the time.
The investigation was suspended, but in 2019 another woman was interviewed stating Williamson would take care of her and her brothers during the day while their father worked. She said the incidents started out as molestation when he would bathe and dress her. It progressed, and about a year later it became rape, according to the arrest report.
The time frame was not included in the report, but it states Williamson was about 61 to 63 years old during the incidents. A separate information report lists the years as 1996 to 1999.
The victim said she was scared and had urinary tract infections and would frequently urinate on herself. After noticing this at school, a woman asked her what was wrong and she told her what Williamson was doing, the report states.
The woman at the school told Dyal’s wife. Once it was made known to Dyal, the girl and her brothers were separated and sent to live with other families in the church, which is what the girl said she feared would happen if she disclosed the assaults. Williamson was allowed to stay at the church until the girl told another woman about him, and he was sent away, according to the report.
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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I am often accused by readers of misrepresenting Evangelicals in my writing; that my descriptions and criticisms of Evangelicalism don’t apply to a reader’s sect, their church, or to them personally. I have heard, more times than I can count, Evangelicals say: my church is different, my pastor is different, my denomination is different, my college is different, I’m DIFFERENT, DIFFERENT, DIFFERENT! While it is certainly true that not all Evangelicals are the same, often the alleged differences are little more than the differences between ice cream flavors. Same basic ingredients with different flavors and toppings. Evangelicals can whine, bitch, moan, and complain about my writing, but the fact remains that I was part of Evangelicalism for 50 years, an Evangelical pastor for 25 of those years, and have Evangelical family members — including pastors, evangelists, and missionaries — and closely follow the machinations of the Evangelical community. I am confident I have a good handle on Evangelical beliefs and practices.
Over the years, I have perused the doctrinal statements of numerous Evangelical sects, churches, and parachurch organizations. The agreement I find in these documents allows me to determine what Evangelicals believe. For twenty-five years, I pastored seven Evangelical churches, so I think I have a good handle on the “faith once delivered to the saints.”
But, Bruce, Evangelicals don’t agree with one another on a host of theological beliefs! I understand that, but such differences are tangential to the cardinal doctrines (almost) all Evangelicals profess to believe. Thus, Charismatics speak in tongues, Baptists don’t. Holiness Christians believe in entire sanctification, Baptists don’t. Some Evangelicals are Calvinists some are Arminians, and others are Calminians. Evangelicals are all over the place when it comes to eschatology and ecclesiology. Some believe baptism is required for salvation, others don’t. The list of differences is extensive. See, Bruce, you are proving my point! No, I am not. If you look underneath these peripheral differences — often called “distinctives” — you find unity of belief:
Anyone who claims to be an Evangelical yet denies one or more of these cardinal doctrines is Evangelical in name only. The fringe of the Evangelical tent is littered with pastors, professors, and congregants who hold all sorts of liberal/progressive Christian beliefs, yet refuse to own what they are. And I get it. Towards the tail end of my ministerial career, some of my beliefs were definitely not Evangelical. Yet, Evangelicalism was home. It was all that I had ever known. I couldn’t bring myself to abandon my metaphorical family, even though I was liberal/progressive belief-wise. Even today, sixteen years removed from walking away from Christianity, I still, at times, miss my family. Not Jesus, not the ministry, but the social connection I had with many loving, wonderful people.
Often, Evangelicals think I am misrepresenting them when I have the audacity to claim that Evangelicals are Fundamentalists. This argument alone has led to all sorts of objections from Evangelicals who scream from rooftops, I AM NOT A FUNDAMENTALIST! However, as I show in my post, Are Evangelical Fundamentalists?, Evangelicals are inherently Fundamentalists both theologically and socially. There’s simply no way to be a consistent Evangelical and not be a Fundamentalist.
Well, Bruce, I don’t care what you say, I am an Evangelical, and I am not a Fundamentalist! You can self-identify any way you want, but just because you do so doesn’t change the fact that your theological beliefs and social practices are Fundamentalist. If you walk, talk, and act like a Fundamentalist, you are one.
I get it. Evangelicalism is one of the most hated religious groups in the United States. Thoughtful, kind, generous Evangelicals hate what Donald Trump and his merry band of culture warriors have done to our country. However, is the answer to stay on the deck of the Titanic as it rolls into the sea? If you are truly not a Fundamentalist, then join up with sects and churches that reflect your progressive/liberal beliefs and practices. Stop enabling the Evangelical monster. Let it die the death it so richly deserves.
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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Originally posted in 2015
From your earliest recollection, you remember the church.
You remember the preacher, the piano player, the deacons, and your Sunday School teacher.
You remember the youth group and all the fun activities.
You remember getting saved and baptized.
You remember being in church every time the doors were open.
You remember everything in your life revolving around the church.
You remember praying and reading your Bible.
You remember the missionaries and the stories they told about heathens on the other side of the world.
You remember revival meetings and getting right with God.
You remember . . .
Most of all you remember the people.
These were the people who loved you. You thought to yourself, my church family loves me almost as much as God does.
You remember hearing sermons about God’s love and the love Christians were supposed to have for one another.
Like your blood family, your church family loves you no matter what.
But then IT happened.
You know, IT.
You got older. You grew up. With adult eyes, you began to see the church, God, Jesus, and the Bible differently.
You had questions, questions that no one had answers for.
Perhaps you began to see that your church family wasn’t perfect.
Perhaps the things Mom and Dad whispered about in the bedroom became known to you.
Perhaps you found out that things were not as they seemed.
Uncertainty and doubt crept in.
Perhaps you decided to try the world for a while. Lots of church kids did, you told yourself.
Perhaps you came to the place where you no longer believed what you had believed your entire life.
And so you left.
You had an IT moment — that moment in time when things changed forever.
You thought, surely, Mom and Dad will still love me.
You thought, surely, Sissy and Bubby and Granny will still love me.
And above all, you thought your church family would love you no matter what.
But they didn’t.
For all their talk of love, their love was conditioned on you being one of them, believing the right things.
Once you left, the love stopped.
Now they are praying for you.
Now you are a sermon illustration trotted out as a warning to people who question and doubt.
Now they plead with you to return to Jesus.
Now they question if you were ever really saved.
They say they still love you, but deep down you know they don’t.
You know their love for you requires you to be like them.
You can’t be like them anymore. . .
Such loss.
Time marches on.
The church is still where it has always been.
The same families are there, loving Jesus and speaking of their great love for others.
But you are forgotten.
A sheep gone astray.
Every once in a while, someone asks your mom and dad how you are doing.
They sigh, perhaps tears well up in their eyes . . .
Oh, how they wish you would come home.
To be a family sitting together in the church again.
You can’t go back.
You no longer believe.
All that you really want now is their love.
You want them to love you just as you are.
Can they do this?
Will they do this?
Or is Jesus more important to them than you?
Does the church come first?
Is chapter and verse more important than flesh and blood?
You want to be told they love you.
You want to be held and told it is going to be all right.
But here you sit tonight . . .
Alone . . .
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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Every year or two, I ask readers to submit questions they want me to answer. That time has arrived once again. Any question. Any subject. Please leave your questions in the comment section or send them to me via email. I will try to answer them in the order received.
I look forward to reading and answering your questions.
Dr. David Tee, whose real name is Derrick Thomas Thiessen, continues to write posts about me and my British friend, Ben Berwick. I have largely ignored him. Thiessen is a rabid Fundamentalist, and at his advanced age, it is unlikely that anything will move him away from Bible literalism and young earth creationism. He is not interested in debate, argument, or discussion. He is convinced that he is one hundred percent right, and that atheists, agnostics, liberal Christians, and other people he deems “unsaved,” are one hundred percent wrong. Thiessen has no room for question, doubt, or nuance. As a true-blue Fundamentalist, everything to him is black and white. So, I no longer try to reason with Thiessen. I have kicked the dust off my sandals and left him to his own devices.
I do, however, want to respond to a post Thiessen wrote yesterday titled I Have a Question. As you will see, Thiessen really doesn’t have any questions to ask me. He just wants to attack my person and besmirch my character. I will be the better man and answer him anyway.
All spelling and grammar in the original.
BG [Bruce Gerencser] may say that we are not banned on his website but we are not going to post there and give him the opportunity to ban us. We will address any information we glean from his website here. That way nothing can be edited or changed on us.
Thiessen is NOT banned from commenting on this site. Any assertion that suggests otherwise is a lie. Thiessen is free to comment any time he wants. I have also offered to debate him. I have even offered to publish a guest post of his. He claims that he is afraid to do so because I might edit or change his words. I have told him several times I will publish exactly what he writes — unedited. I will even leave his misspellings and grammar errors as is. Come on Derrick, time to man up.
Currently, he has this annual theme where he allows his readers to ask him any question they want. it goes under the same title heading above – I have a question- and I guess he selects the ones he will answer.
Note that Thiessen tries to suggest that I pick and choose which questions to answer. This, of course, is untrue. I answer every question I receive, even from him and his bunkmate Revival Fires.
Question One: Why does a guy with nothing to offer keep posting ‘his’ story which hasn’t changed in 10 or 11 years?
As you can see, Thiessen makes a value judgment: a guy with nothing to offer. I am a guy who has nothing to offer closed-minded Fundamentalists like him. It seems thousands of other people disagree with him; people who found value and support from my writing. I know my work is not for everyone, so why doesn’t Thiessen stop reading it and mosey on his way? If certain foods constipate you or aggravate your hemorrhoids, change your diet. Instead, Derrick would rather bitch about how much his anus hurts.
I suspect I have a lot more of my story to tell, even from my Christian days. Unlike Thiessen, my life continues to move forward, and as I continue to walk this path called life, I will have new and varied experiences. And when I do, I will write about them. I am a story-teller, Thiessen is not. He chooses, instead, to preach, teach, and rage. And that’s fine, but there’s no reason for him to criticize me for choosing a different path.
My story is not the only subject for my writing. I write about sports, politics, humanism, atheism, cooking, chronic illness, chronic pain, the Independent Fundamentalist Baptist (IFB) church movement, Evangelicalism, and a plethora of other subjects. And even if I did ONLY write about my story, what’s wrong with that? Every blog has a niche, Thiessen’s included.
His previous answer to us was ‘he wanted people to know his story’. Yet, he could have done that in one website page or one post. However, he keeps repeating the same thing over and over, and over, as if no one has read it before.
I have explained this to Thiessen several times, so I can only conclude that he is being deliberately obtuse. A majority of readers on any given day are new. They don’t know my story, so as a good writer, I believe it is incumbent upon me to share with them who I am, who I was, what I believe, and where I’m headed. Yes, regular readers know my story, but most first-time readers don’t. I make no apology for making sure people know my storyline.
Thiessen shares nothing about his past and present life. He hides from accountability and responsibility in the Philippines, not letting anyone see and know the man he really is. Again, this is his choice, but I shouldn’t be faulted for choosing another path.
Thiessen must live a boring, uneventful life if it fits on a single website page or blog post. I have had an interesting life, filled with all sorts of experiences. Take my short stories series. I am sitting on over a hundred short story draft posts I have not published. I enjoy telling stories, and I plan to tell a lot more of them in the months and years ahead. Hopefully, many of these stories will be published in book form.
The obvious answer is that he is a narcissist and wants everyone to think he is a victim. His continuous reference to ‘his story’ makes his content useless, boring, and out of touch. He needs the attention.
Now Thiessen makes things personal, asserting without evidence that I am a narcissist and a victim. I will leave it to others to decide whether I am a narcissist, but as far as being a victim is concerned, I have faced a lot of trauma in my life. In a clinical sense, I am a victim, a survivor. Should I ignore these experiences in my life? I choose to use them to fuel my passion and help other people. My therapist tells me that my continued writing is essential to managing my depression.
Thiessen expresses his feelings when he says my writing is useless, boring, and out of touch. He is entitled to his opinions, but my email inbox and social media messages suggest that a lot of people find my work useful, engaging, and relevant. That Thiessen doesn’t is his problem, not mine.
Question Two: Why does he keep beating a dead horse?
The “dead horse” Thiessen speaks of is any subject I write about that he disagrees with. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. Thiessen writes about the same subjects over, and over, and over. Again, he is free to do so. But why is Thiessen so obsessed with policing the content on another creator’s website. This would be like me telling the writers at Science-Based Medicine that they are beating a dead horse. All they talk about is science and medicine. Duh, right. I read their writing because it especially deals with these subjects. I don’t go to their site to find information on Evangelical Christianity. They have a wheelhouse, as do I. I talk about what I know. Too bad Thiessen doesn’t do the same.
Question Three: Why do you continually make yourself look bad?
This is a question about his black-collar series. As we have talked about this before, it does not make BG look like a saint for his reporting of these arrests. Actually, it makes him look bad as he piles on those unfortunate souls as well as rubbing it in their and their families’ faces.
Those types of postings are not making BG look good. It makes him look like some hate-filled person who does not have an ounce of sympathy, forgiveness, or kindness in him. One reason for that is because he is rifling through law enforcement and news outlet files to get the information LONG AFTER the ‘crimes’ have been committed.
He is not helping anyone but he does look vindictive and mean-spirited in his actions. he also looks void of any love and compassion as love does not rejoice in evil. He is rejoicing as he gets clicks when he posts those articles.
Thiessen has repeatedly objected to the Black Collar Crime Series. He continues to defend criminal preachers, including sexual predators. He prefers that their crimes — which he calls “mistakes” — never see the light of day. He doesn’t want the world to know that Evangelicalism has a huge problem with sexual misconduct — every bit as bad as, if not worse than that of the Roman Catholic Church. (Why I Write The Black Collar Crime Series and Will Continue to Do So Despite Criticism from Evangelicals.)
Thiessen wants me to “care” and “love: these predators. Give me a fucking break. I’ll tell you who I care for: the children they molest and rape; the church women they take sexual advantage of; the teens they seduce and assault; the church people whom they steal from and take advantage of. My care and love is reserved for the victims and the families of predators. The criminals themselves? I want to see them prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. I want to make sure they never, ever pastor a church or have an opportunity to harm people again.
Thiessen, on the other hand, thinks these perverts should be forgiven and restored to the ministry. How sick is that? I have often wondered why he is so anti-victim. What’s the story behind his support of sexual deviants, while at the same time deriding their victims?
As long as preachers continue preying on innocent, vulnerable children, teens, and adults, I plan to continue publishing the Black Collar Crime Series.
It will be interesting to see what his responses will be. He won’t be allowed to post them here. So hopefully we will get a pingback.
Thiessen refuses to let anyone comment on his blog. He also has disabled his contact page. He is immune from criticism and accountability. Nothing I can do about that.
I have sufficiently answered Thiessen’s comments. I am sure he will object to my answers, which he is free to do. As always, I will leave it to readers to weigh the worthiness and value of my writing. Thiessen not liking it is a badge of honor.
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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Every study I have read in the past decade suggests that atheism and agnosticism are on the rise; that nones — those who are indifferent towards religion are on the rise; that Christianity in the United States is in decline, as evidenced by shrinking membership, Sunday attendance, and income. As it stands today, non-believers are the largest religious demographic in the U.S. Christianity is on its way to becoming a minority religion.
Bill Muehlenberg, an Evangelical Christian who blogs at Culture Watch, is ignorantly or deliberately oblivious to these facts. According to him, atheism has lost its luster and is in decline. Worse, an increasing number of atheists are converting to Christianity, or, at the very least, confessing belief in God.
Who are these atheists who have left godlessness for religion?
Color me grossly underwhelmed. What we have here is a list of Christian apologists (some of whom have sketchy conversion stories, alleged conversion stories that contradict Muhlenberg’s Evangelical Christianity, and people who lived using the late nineteenth and twentieth centuries. Where are all the present-day atheists who converted to Christianity? I guarantee you that there are a lot more notable, public theists deconverting than atheists are becoming Christians. It happens, but not often, and when it does, those who embrace Christianity do so for emotional, and not intellectual reasons.
As can be seen, most of these folks were/are noted public figures. Not only were they all either atheists or agnostics, but quite a few were also Marxists, Communists or socialists as well. I might add that I too was once not only a firm agnostic but a young revolutionary and socialist.
….
The list I have offered in this piece is very short indeed. Many more names could have been mentioned. And I also could have discussed some leading public figures who all seem quite close to becoming Christians – or perhaps already have – people such as Jordan Peterson, Tom Holland, Douglas Murray, Russell Brand and many more.
God is clearly not dead. Many atheists are however. Or they have seen the light and left their former darkness.
Muhlenberg intimates that Christopher Hitchens was “open” to Christianity before he died and may even converted, relying on Alex Taunton’s screed, The Faith of Christopher Hitchens.
Wikipedia has this to say, about Taunton’s book:
Taunton’s book attracted some media attention and Taunton was interviewed on Newsnight on BBC Two alongside Lawrence Krauss who strongly criticized the book and alleged Taunton was a “paid associate” and not a friend of Hitchens. He also suggested Hitchens’ widow was “disgusted” by the book. The Faith of Christopher Hitchens received a mixed critical reception. Nick Cohen, a friend of Hitchens, was strongly critical of the book in The Guardian. Cohen described it as “strange, spiteful”, the “work of a true fanatic”. Cohen is critical of the several attacks made by Taunton on friends of Hitchens. Cohen also wrote that “In a section that is tasteless even by his low standards, he ridicules Christopher’s father, Eric, as a weak man, because his failure to discipline his children ‘contributed to his son’s unbelief'” and wrote that the “willingness of believers to go further and invent conversions where none existed satisfies their infantile need for fairytale endings…they move from the extremely seedy to the outright creepy: from vultures to vampires.”
Also in The Guardian Matthew d’Ancona depicted the book as “meretricious” and as the latest example of falsified deathbed conversion stories. He also wrote that whilst it is “tempting to write off this book as outburst of epic self-deception” d’Ancona wrote that “its craven purpose – to claim Hitchens posthumously for evangelical Christianity – is to defame a man who was a champion of the Enlightenment” and an enemy of all religion. David Frum, writing in The Atlantic, stated that “In the months before he died, Hitchens repeatedly and emphatically warned that claims like Taunton’s would be forthcoming and should be disbelieved.” and that “Taunton mistakes curiosity for assent.”
Keep drinking the Kool-Aid, Bill. What atheism may yet become is unknown, but it is clear that atheists are not going away or dying off. Atheism, as a movement, is evolving and maturing. The field has been cleared of theist arguments for the existence of God, so atheists have moved on to more pressing issues such as the separation of church and state, Christian nationalism, and other assaults on liberty and freedom. Talking about the Kalam argument, the argument from design, the ontological argument, and others is passé these days. Been there, done that, these arguments fail every time.
Try harder, Bill, try harder.
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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What is antisemitism?
Anti-Semitism is hostility to, prejudice towards, or discrimination against Jews.
What it’s not.
It’s not Anti-zionism.
It’s not opposition to Israel’s genocidal war against the Palestinian people.
It’s not opposition to illegal Israeli settlements in the West Bank.
It is not challenges to Israel’s Old Testament and political origins.
It is not opposition to U.S. military aid to Israel.
It is not protesting Israel’s murderous violence against Palestinian men, women, children, and babies.
It is not giving a speech supporting Palestinians.
It is not giving a speech condemning Israeli settlements in the West Bank.
It is not calls for disinvestment from Israel.
It is not support for competing non-Jewish states such as Iran and other Muslim countries.
It is not demanding a free, equal, UN-recognized state for Palestinians.
It is not demanding all illegal Israeli settlements be removed from Palestinian territory.
I am sure readers can come up with other things that are not anti-Semitism, yet people who voice them are often called anti-Semites.
Anti-Semites are hostile to, prejudiced towards, or they discriminate against Jews. I do none of these things. I do, however, oppose Israel’s war against the Palestinian people, the building of settlements on Palestinian land, and the United States continued financial support of Israel’s military. I support calls for disinvestment from Israel and the immediate establishment of a Palestinian state. Holding these positions does not make me an anti-Semite. Zionists and Christian Fundamentalists who think the Bible prophesies the establishment of the state of Israel who continue to call me an anti-Semite do so out of either ignorance or deliberate attempts to smear and denigrate anyone who opposes Israel’s political policies and military violence.
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Connect with me on social media:
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
You can email Bruce via the Contact Form.
Every year or two, I ask readers to submit questions they want me to answer. That time has arrived once again. Any question. Any subject. Please leave your questions in the comment section or send them to me via email. I will try to answer them in the order received.
I look forward to reading and answering your questions.
Long-time reader Geoff asked:
How do you feel the ‘argument from reason’ is going? YouTube is awash with atheist presenters, much of it pretty poor, but there’s a core of really convincing channels, very moderate in approach, and with ever-increasing subscribers. I’m thinking especially of the likes of Genetically Modified Skeptik, Alex O’Connor Cosmic Skeptik, and Rationality Rules. Previously Matt Dillahunty and Atheist Experience was perhaps the main source, but Dillahunty’s abrasive style and the awful quality of the phone-ins surely put many people off, and there was certainly little in the way of developing nuanced arguments.
Anyhow, I feel that the argument from reason is now so overwhelmingly in favour of the atheist case that I feel apologetics is almost dead in the water, but perhaps it’s simply that I’m immersed at ‘the wrong end of the pool’. What do you think?
Go to YouTube these days and you will find a plethora of atheist creators putting out content that challenges Christianity, using philosophical and scientific arguments to do so. YouTubers such as Alex O’Connor, Steven Woodford, Drew McCoy, Matt Dillahunty, and others are well-schooled in philosophy and the various arguments for the existence of God and other arguments used to justify Christian belief. I thoroughly enjoy their videos, although I have reached a similar point to Geoff, that there are no more new arguments to be made; that much like Samson slaying 1,000 Philistines with the jawbone of an ass, these defenders of rationality, skepticism, and reason have slayed virtually every argument used by Evangelical and Catholic apologists to defend the existence of God and the claims of Christianity.
If I have one point of criticism of these atheists it is this: when it comes to theology and the Biblical text itself, they often display a shallow or Fundamentalist understanding of what the Bible says and what Christians really believe. Some of them just regurgitate what they have heard other atheists say, while others lack sufficient education to have complex, informed discussions about the Biblical text and Christianity. Sometimes, I will email them when they make glaring errors, hoping to educate them on the subject in question. Unfortunately, I have yet to have one of them respond to me. If you are going to make content deconstructing what it is that Christians believe, it would be helpful if you actually KNOW what they believe. And Christians are just as bad. They can be woefully ignorant about the Bible and its teachings, and when it comes to church history, ignorance is the norm.
There indeed is a lot of atheist-created content on YouTube and TikTok. Juvenile, elementary-level critiques — long on rhetoric and ridicule — can be found everywhere on social media. I used to challenge such things, but I gave up. Some of the creators are in the “angry atheist” phase of life, so I know that no amount of calm, rational criticism will change their minds. It takes time for wounds to heal.
Have atheists won the day? Perhaps, but there’s still a place for well-spoken, thoughtful atheists to produce content for public consumption. As I have pondered starting a podcast (I know, I know, I have been pondering for so long we are in a new decade) I ask myself, “What can I add to the discussions that atheists and Christians might find helpful?” My thought as of today — subject to change — is to start a podcast that specifically focuses on the Independent Fundamentalist Baptist (IFB) church movement. There’s very little content on this subject, and since my expertise lies here, I thought the IFB might be a worthy subject of a new podcast. While I can intelligently discuss the existence of God and I have a rudimentary understanding of science, a philosopher and scientist (in an educated sense) I am not. I know what I know, and I certainly know what I don’t.
I watch or listen to The Atheist Experience, Talk Heathen, Pangburn, Truth Wanted, SciManDan, MythVision, Dan McClellan, Bart Ehrman, Belief It or Not, Data Over Dogma, Digital Hammurabi, Gutsick Gibbon, James Tabor, Jon Perry, Kip Davis, and several programs on The Line Network featuring Matt Dillahunty as host. (I also listen to some political, science, and sports podcasts.) I agree that Dillahunty has become increasingly angry and argumentative over the years, but I do love his content, especially his debates or table discussions with various atheists and Christians. (The Christians who call in to atheist talk shows are generally dreadful, lacking in solid theological training and understanding of church history.) I really enjoyed his recent debate with Than Christopoulos on the resurrection of Jesus. Wonderful discussion. Both men were thoughtful and polite.
I deconverted sixteen years ago. Since then, I have interacted with countless Christians, especially Evangelicals. It has been years since I have heard a new or original argument for the existence of God and the nature of the Biblical text. I am far less patient these days due to having to answer the same questions, arguments, and challenges over and over and over again. It does get old after a while. I suspect some of the creators mentioned above will one day reach a similar place. Contrary to what Evangelical apologists say, the Bible is not an inexhaustive book. Eventually, there’s nothing more to say on the matter.
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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Every year or two, I ask readers to submit questions they want me to answer. That time has arrived once again. Any question. Any subject. Please leave your questions in the comment section or send them to me via email. I will try to answer them in the order received.
I look forward to reading and answering your questions.
A reader recently asked:
Do you have a good relationship with all of your kids? Did any of them ever express resentment or say they’re damaged from being raised IFB (due to fear of hell, sexism, homophobia, general shame, etc)? Do you think it’s possible to still spend time with family members who are still hardcore believers when you’re raising your own kid differently without it damaging your kid?
My partner, Polly, and I have six adult children, ages 45, 43, 40, 35, 33, and 31 (on their next birthday). Four of our children are married or living in committed relationships. We have sixteen grandchildren, ranging in age from five to twenty-three. By all accounts, both Polly and I have good relationships with our children and their families. All of our children live within twenty minutes of our home in Ney. Some of them we see once or more every week. For others, it may be a few weeks between visits. Regardless, both Polly and I think we are close to our children and their families. Whether our children think the same, you would have to ask them. As a man who is largely homebound due to chronic illness and pain, I would love to see my children, their spouses, and grandchildren more often. I recognize they have their own lives, jobs, and responsibilities, but I do yearn for more visits and interaction, as does Polly.
What constitutes a “good relationship” depends on the parties involved. I have different experiences and relationships with each of my children. How they view me as their father is theirs to share. As far as I know, my children love and respect me. Over the past two weeks, I have seen all our children — save son #2; and he and I have stayed in contact via texts. On Sunday, our youngest daughter and her three children came over for lunch, as did our oldest son and two of his three children. He and our oldest grandson, Levi, cleaned out our gutters and unplugged the downspouts. Our youngest son mows our grass every week, and then stays for dinner. Last night, I talked with son #3 about a family problem he was having. We spoke for an hour.
Our family is close, and always willing to help us when needed. And we do the same for them. Could we be closer? Sure. Does our family have unresolved conflict or trauma? Sure, as ALL families do. That said, if you really want to know how our children view their relationships with Mom and Dad, you will have to ask them. I cannot and will not speak for them.
This reader also asked, “Did any of them ever express resentment or say they’re damaged from being raised IFB?”
Not towards their parents. They understand why we were IFB and Mom and Dad were devout Evangelical Christians. They don’t blame us as much as they do the Independent Fundamentalist Baptist (IFB) church movement itself. They know we were products of lifelong conditioning and indoctrination. As far as resentment is concerned, I have never sensed resentment from any of our children. The Gerencser family is quite stoic, living “live and let live” lives. Do we talk about the past? Sure. Are apologies made and regrets shared? Yes.
Our children, except Bethany — our oldest daughter with Down syndrome — own their own homes and live on their own. If one of them were a hardcore Fundamentalist Christian, could I still have a good relationship with him or her? I’d like to think so. However, I know sects such as the IFB are exclusionary, reactionary, and narrow-minded. This means that we might not be able to openly and frankly talk with them about certain things. Knowing this, I would do everything in my power to have a good relationship with them. Polly and I deconverted seventeen years ago. Our family remains close,
Our family is far from perfect, but I wouldn’t trade them for all the money in the world.
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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The Black Collar Crime Series relies on public news stories and publicly available information for its content. If any incorrect information is found, please contact Bruce Gerencser. Nothing in this post should be construed as an accusation of guilt. Those accused of crimes are innocent until proven guilty.
Joshua LeDuc, a pre-K teacher at Bethel United Church of Christ’s “Bethel Buddies” preschool in Evansville, Indiana, recently pleaded guilty to sexually molesting children in his care.
In February 2024, the Courier & Post reported:
A former Evansville preschool teacher accused in August of molesting a student is behind bars again after prosecutors charged him with two additional child sexual abuse offenses.
Evansville police arrested 21-year-old Joshua Brandon Leduc on Wednesday evening on charges of child seduction, a Level 3 felony, and child molesting, a Level 3 felony. Leduc formerly taught pre-kindergarten classes at Bethel United Church of Christ.
Leduc was arrested and charged with two counts of child molestation in August after he was allegedly recorded by classroom surveillance cameras sexually assaulting a 4-year-old girl, police said.
Leduc was out on bond in that case when he was arrested Wednesday, court records show.
Bethel United Church of Christ terminated Leduc’s employment Aug. 2 after it was made aware of the first allegation, lead pastor Samuel Buehrer told the Courier & Press.
According to EPD Detective Cameron Werne, a second student accused Leduc of molestation in February.
Writing in an affidavit of probable cause, Werne said the 6-year-old victim attended Bethel Buddies, the church’s preschool, from August 2021 to July 2022. During a forensic interview conducted at Holly’s House, a victims’ advocacy center in Evansville, the child reportedly said Leduc touched her inappropriately as she built a puzzle in his classroom.
According to the affidavit, the victim identified Leduc in a randomized photo lineup as the man who molested her.
….
The church informed the Vanderburgh County Department of Child Services in August that Leduc had been accused of molesting a student, according Buehrer. The EPD took up the investigation and spoke to the victim’s mother about the alleged abuse.
In a written affidavit, Werne said he reviewed surveillance footage recorded by a camera in Leduc’s classroom that appeared to corroborate the first victim’s account. The footage, according to Werne, showed Leduc molesting the victim behind a cabinet.
Surveillance footage captured in the school’s hallway also appeared to show Leduc following the victim into a restroom, where he remained with the victim for more than three minutes, Werne wrote.
Buehrer said the church installed cameras in classrooms prior to the August incident in order to protect students and teachers. After the footage showed Leduc allegedly using furniture to block the cameras, Buehrer said the school reorganized classroom layouts.
“We’ve also moved some cameras to what we think might be better locations,” Buehrer said. “We moved the rooms around and the furniture in the rooms to eliminate any blind spots.”
Leduc is currently being held at the Vanderburgh County jail on a $100,000 bond, according to court records. Vanderburgh County Superior Court Judge Robert Pigman set Leduc’s bond during his initial court appearance Thursday morning.
Gray said the EPD encourages any parent who feels their child may have been victimized “to call 911 and report it so it can be investigated.”
Buehrer said the school took a “proactive” approach to improve child safety following Leduc’s first arrest in August.
“It’s painful when these things happen; you never wish them to happen on your watch,” Buehrer said. “We’re just praying for everybody and praying for justice in this case.”
Today, the Courier & Press reported:
A former pre-kindergarten teacher who stood accused of molesting two students in Evansville pleaded guilty Tuesday, nixing the prospect of a jury trial in the case.
The former teacher, 22-year-old Joshua Brandon Leduc, faced charges of child seduction and three counts of child molesting across two criminal cases, according to Vanderburgh County court records.
Those cases were joined, and a trial had been scheduled to begin this week. The proceedings were called off on Friday when Deputy Prosecuting Attorney Audrey Beckerle and Leduc’s defense attorney, Barry Blackard, informed the court both sides had reached an agreement.
Leduc formally pleaded guilty Tuesday, court filings show, but the terms of the agreement were not listed in public court records as of Tuesday afternoon.
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Connect with me on social media:
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
You can email Bruce via the Contact Form.
The Black Collar Crime Series relies on public news stories and publicly available information for its content. If any incorrect information is found, please contact Bruce Gerencser. Nothing in this post should be construed as an accusation of guilt. Those accused of crimes are innocent until proven guilty.
Keith Holt, former assistant pastor (or fill-in pastor) of House of Prayer Church in Blackwell, Oklahoma, and his wife, Candy, stand accused of child abuse and neglect.
Keith Lynn Holt, 57, and Candy Denise Holt, 53, both of Blackwell, are scheduled to appear in Kay County District Court on March 1.
Keith, a former assistant pastor at House of Prayer Church in Blackwell, is facing three felony counts of child abuse and one count of child neglect, while his wife Candy, is facing three felony charges of enabling child abuse and one charge of child neglect.
The pair were arrested by Blackwell police on Jan. 17. (see story)
Police report in the affidavit that the couple were arrested following an investigation that started with the Department of Human Services.
DHS workers report in the affidavit that they received a report that the couple went to Arkansas and left eight children ranging from ages two to 17 home alone.
Officials report they went to the residence and found an adult friend checking on the juveniles.
The next day, Jan. 12, officials returned to the home and made contact with the Holts. The couple reportedly admitted that they went to Arkansas to attend a funeral.
During an investigation, they reportedly stated that the kids have items taken away for punishment and claimed that they do not spank the children. They explained that the two of the teens are biological children of Keith, three of the children are Candy’s nieces and nephews, and that three of the juveniles were left to them in a will.
On Jan. 14, DHS workers report that they received photos showing the 14-year-old with bruising on her face and a video of a juvenile male stating that Keith had punched him and thrown him down the stairs.
After receiving the information, DHS and a police officer went to the home two times. But no one answered.
On Jan. 16, officials returned and Candy answered the door.
A representative of the Dearing House interviewed one of the teens.
The teen’s arms and legs were reportedly covered in bruises. She claimed that Keith hits her with a board. The teen reportedly retrieved a 28-inch-long board from behind the television. The board was reportedly just over two inches wide and about an inch thick.
The teen was interviewed by a Dearing House official. During the interview she reportedly removed her make up, revealing bruising around her left eye.
She alleged that Keith would hit the juveniles with a belt and or the board and would start at the waist and work his way down.
She claimed that Keith threw one of the teens down the stairs and that the couple locked one of the teens in a bathroom for three days with out food or water. The teen said she was able to sneak some crackers and water to the juvenile.
Another teen was interviewed and claimed that Candy does nothing around the house. The teen reportedly said she is responsible for taking care of the three small children and that Keith whipped her on her legs for not having their clothes picked out. The teen reportedly said she was the one locked in the bathroom because the Holt’s believed that she said they were bad parents. The teen reportedly told officials that one time she received 30 swats with the belt from Keith and that he has switched to the board. She claimed that one time Keith swatted one of the females 40 times with the board because Candy couldn’t find her make up and believed the teen took it.
The juvenile male in the video reportedly denied making the tape.
Another juvenile male reportedly told officials that the Holt’s do not hit him because he threatened to hit them back. He backed up allegations made by the other teens.
Another juvenile male reportedly also backed up the claims made by the others and said that the couple leave him alone because he can’t control his anger and that he will hurt them.
The couple were arrested and questioned at the Blackwell police station.
Chief Jay Brewer reports that Candy stated that the kids are honest and that if they said something happened, she believes them. She reportedly spoke of an incident in which Keith spanked one of the juveniles with a belt 16 times and that she had to stop him. She reportedly denied being present for beatings and denied knowing about the teen locked in the bathroom.
Brewer reports that Keith stated that the kids are trustworthy and don’t lie. He reportedly initially denied hitting any of the juveniles since moving to Blackwell but reportedly changed his story. He reportedly admitted to hitting one of the juveniles two times on the buttocks with the board. He claimed that he only whips the children on the buttocks and not the legs and reportedly admitted that he never checked to see of he left bruises on the kids. He reportedly said that it is possible that he hits them so much he doesn’t remember each incident.
Brewer reports that Holt said that he might black out and doesn’t know how many times he hits them.
He reportedly claimed the kids must by lying but doesn’t know what their motivation would be. Holt also reportedly denied locking a teen in a bathroom for three days but admitted that there is a lock outside the upstairs bathroom door.
The couple are being held in the county jail on $100,000 bond and defense attorney Jarrod Stevenson has been appointed to the case.
House of Prayer pastor John Jack released the following statement:
The Blackwell House of Prayer rebukes all statements and actions carried out by Keith Holt. The Bible speaks against child abuse or any mistreatment of children, and we stand firmly by that. The House of Prayer was also never made aware by these children of any indication that this was being carried out.
Really, Pastor Jack? Not one person ever saw a bruise or injury on these children? Never?
Bruce Gerencser, 66, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 45 years. He and his wife have six grown children and thirteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Connect with me on social media:
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
You can email Bruce via the Contact Form.
