Dr. David Tee, an Evangelical preacher whose real name is Derrick Thomas Thiessen, mounted his blog pulpit to opine about my use of narcotic medication for chronic pain. Thiessen’s post is in response to Will the War on Chronic Pain Sufferers Ever End?:
We were at the BG website the other day and we read a big whining article about his need for opiates to control his pain. However, he was whining about the rules that govern the usage of opiates and he did not like them.
As usual, he wanted people to break the rules for him and other opiate medication needing pain sufferers. However, he knew the rules and he should not whine. it is life. Governments have a moral responsibility to regulate medications so they are not abused.
He does not like that either but the government is supposed to exist to protect people from themselves among other things. We had a guy like this in Korea. He fought hard tp [pass a law that all NETs had to have a clean criminal record history in order to teach in the country.
We fought against him but his side won. The next thing we read in the Korea Times is an article about his whining that his criminal record, as slight as it was, should be given a pass even though his advocacy led to many people losing their jobs.
He whined about having a family to feed, etc., yet he could no longer teach. He only has himself to blame as he is one of those people, like BG who think their personal circumstances allow them to violate the rules. While everyone else has to follow them.
My post was about how the government is presently waging war against people with chronic pain; how following the rules left me without pain medications for almost five days. I wasn’t whining, I was shouting. Thiessen shows no sympathy or compassion for me. “Just suck it up, BG, them’s the rules.” Spoken like a True Fundamentalist, always following rules.
Thiessen says that I asked people to break the law for me. I most certainly did not, and I can find no evidence that remotely justifies his claim. I have had a handful of readers offer to help me pain-wise over the years; people willing to commit a crime to get me what I need (This is the third time in recent years that I have had to go through withdrawals due to pharmacies not having my medication.) I always say no, save for the time a reader sent me some Kratom and CBD products. I have never asked someone to break the law for me. I would never knowingly risk the freedom and economic security of others just for pain relief.
I am, however, quite willing to break the law myself, and that’s exactly what I did on Thursday. We drove to Michigan to check out a cannabis store. We had a delightful time, both driving through Amish country and perusing the store’s products. The staff was helpful, suggesting what works best for nausea and chronic pain. I bought $120 of gummies and prerolls. So far, the marijuana has helped with my pain and general flu-like feeling from narcotics withdrawal.
It is government that necessitated me to break the law. There’s no reason that government at both state and federal levels couldn’t immediately legally legalize pot. I had to choose between dark suicidal thoughts and using an illegal drug I knew could help reduce my suffering (which was affecting my mental health). I chose the latter. I regret to inform slippery-slope believers: no, I am not already hooked, and no I haven’t already moved on to cocaine (the two things Evangelical preachers often tell youths about marijuana.)
I am an advocate for chronic pain sufferers. I use my stories about experiences with pain and suffering to encourage people who are in pain and to demand government action on better treatment of chronic pain sufferers. I want good laws, effective laws, not laws that foster unnecessary pain and suffering. Of course, Thiessen doesn’t care about any of these things. He is a member of a religious cult that glorifies suffering. Get saved, die, ascend to Heaven, no more pain, stop whining. Of course, none of this is true. As a humanist, I believe this present life is the only one I will ever have. Death is stalking me, and it won’t be long before he catches me. And then, that’s it. I will be turned into ashes and strewn along the eastern shore of Lake Michigan. Why in the world would I not try to find things that will help me physically — even if it meant breaking the law? Less pain means I can be more active and productive.
Or it could be that Derrick Thomas Thiessen lacks the ability to empathize with others; to truly be loving and compassionate. And Thiessen despises me, so in the Good Samaritan story, he’s definitely walking by my bloody body along the roadside, pausing to say “stop whining” as he smugly, self-righteously walks away.
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
David Tee/Derrick Thomas Thiessen is the tall man in the back
Editor’s Note: Dr. David Tee is a fake name used by Derrick Thomas Thiessen, a Christian Missionary and Alliance preacher who fled the United States/Canada twenty years ago and now lives in the Philippines. Thiessen has spent the past two years ripping off my writing, hurling sermons at me, and attacking my character. He has written over one-hundred posts about me. And at times, I respond. (Search for Dr. David Tee and Derrick Thomas Thiessen.) This series will take a look at things Thiessen doesn’t want anyone to know about. Once this series is completed, Tee/Thiessen will no longer be mentioned by me in my writing. You have my word on this subject.
Guest Post by W.W. Jacobs
“Your irrational ‘response’ has no evidence backing it up.” — Derrick Thiessen, 27 July 2022
This exchange eventually escalated to Derrick threatening suits over libel and slander. Problem: accusing someone of libel and slander involves documenting that they knowingly and maliciously disseminated false information.
The information disseminated to date isn’t even false, let alone maliciously disseminated. And what is contained herein is just a portion of the information available to me.
I haven’t decided how far I’m going to dive into this – that will largely depend on my interest and the level of benevolence Bruce is willing to extend – but since the single biggest pet peeve Derrick seems to have is being addressed as “Derrick” and not “David” (which he has the audacity to compare to Saul being renamed Paul) I’ll start there.
The following is excerpted from a sworn deposition that Derrick sat for a number of years ago:
“(The deponent), having affirmed to state the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, testified as follows:
“Would you state your full, legal name please?”
“Derrick Thomas Thiessen.”
“And Derrick is spelled how?”
“D-E-R-R-I-C-K.”
“Your middle name is Thomas, T-H-O-M-A-S?”
“Yes.”
…
“Mr. Thiessen, do you have any other form of ID in any other name, or is Derrick, or David, the name?”
“No. Surname is David, I go by David. My immigration lawyer who filed the paperwork put David Thiessen down as the primary name, so I’ve gone by that instead of Derrick, so all my American ID is in David.”
(Incidentally, Derrick, the next time you’re hard up for money, you may well have a solid malpractice case against the attorney who advocated filling out paperwork listing a name other than the one on the identification issued to you by the Canadian government when you sought to enter the U.S., considering how far your detrimental reliance on that information has spun out of control.)
…
“Mr. Thiessen, have you ever used any other name other than Derrick Thiessen?”
“What?”
(His attorney) “We did discuss his name David Ford, I believe.”
[Ed.: he published a tract or pamphlet entitled “Abortion: Where Can We Turn?” under the pseudonym “John Ford” – not “David Ford” – in the mid-1980s, and testified to same in this deposition.]
“Fine. Did you have any other names, other than David Thiessen?”
“I don’t believe so.”
“What other name did you use?”
“David Ford.”
“Did you use any other names at all?”
(His attorney) “I’m sorry, are we remembering the fact that he also said that Derrick and David is, used those names recently? I just want to make it clear he doesn’t forget we’ve already discussed that.”
“We did discuss his name David Ford, I believe.”
“You testified that you used the name David Ford?”
“Yes.”
“You also testified you used the name David Thiessen?”
“It’s synonymous. I don’t differentiate between the two.”
“Your synonymous names are Derrick Thiessen and David?”
“I use D. David Thiessen, it’s on my American ID.”
“What about the name David Ford?”
“I haven’t used that in years.”
“Why did you use it?”
“I didn’t want my family to find me.”
“Who specifically in your family didn’t you want to find you?”
“My immediate family.”
“Why didn’t you want them to find you?”
“Personal reasons at the time.”
“What were the personal reasons at the time?”
“Just disagreements between the family and me.”
“What type of disagreements?”
“I just said I wasn’t coming back.
“Why did you want them not to find you?”
“Didn’t want anything to do with them.”
…
“So you used the name David Ford?”
“Yes.”
“It’s your testimony that you didn’t use any other false names?”
“Yes.”
“This was a false name, correct?”
“It wasn’t changed legally, but it –“
“That was not your name, correct?”
“For ten years it was, yes.”
“But not your legal name, correct?”
“Not my legal name.”
“Where did you come up with Ford?”
“Came to me. I just picked a name out of the hat.”
(There are other names he acknowledged previously using, including Peter, elsewhere in this deposition.)
So, let’s recap:
Neither “David” nor “Tee” are part of his legal name.
“Derrick Thomas Thiessen” is his legal name.
His legal name has apparently never been changed – through deed poll, civil action, or similar – from “Derrick Thomas Thiessen.”
He did not start calling himself “David” to commemorate some “road to Damascus” moment, but because he wanted to go “no contact” with his family.
In this same deposition, he identifies his parents as “Frank” and “Eleanor.” The cemetery where they are buried records their names as “Franz” and “Elnora.”
As best I’ve been able to determine, they were either first- or second-generation Canadians of German descent. It is certainly understandable why people living in North America in the 1940s might want to downplay their German heritage, thus understandable why they started calling themselves Frank and Eleanor, just as Derrick’s uncle Heinrich started going by Henry. But none of them ever legally changed their names. They also never disclaimed Franz / Heinrich / Elnora as their legal names, they simply started identifying themselves by Anglicized versions of those names.
Derrick is definitively a name of Germanic origin. I gave Derrick the benefit of the doubt and looked into whether “David” (or even “Thomas”) might be an Anglicization of “Derrick.” It is not.
However, “David” is the name he reverted to once he left the company of anyone who was aware of his second marriage. (Yes, his current marriage is at least #3 … what is it Paul instructed Timothy about church leaders being “the husband of one wife”?) He also left the purview of people aware of the child his second marriage produced – including child-support enforcement authorities, who had the name “Derrick Thiessen” flagged for wage garnishment if the name was ever listed on an I-9 form.
But I’m sure Derrick will be happy to explain that it is a complete coincidence that the beginning of his child-support obligations approximately coincide with when he started abbreviating his last name to his college nickname. Just as I’m sure the increased scrutiny of identification and immigration records after 9/11 merely happened to coincide with his “call” to Korea.
One other issue needs to be pointed out. To reiterate, this is Derrick’s sworn testimony under oath. This leaves only a couple of possibilities:
He told the truth in this deposition and has been misrepresenting the truth since then, such as when repeatedly denouncing Bruce’s use of a “wrong name” to identify him. (Even the one admission he made in his own blog implied that he had legally changed his last name, and still paired it with the first name “David.”)
He lied in this deposition, in which case he committed perjury.
Just kidding. There is no third possibility.
Neither lying under oath nor lying in the years since is a good look for a man who claims to lead a broad and far-reaching ministry.
Next time if Bruce’s magnanimity and my schedule permit: why the curriculum at Canadian Bible College [now called Canadian Theological Seminary] apparently does not involve studying Romans 13 or any portion of 1 Timothy. We’ll also discuss the odds of a man with Derrick’s level of arrogance opting not to acknowledge holding a degree more advanced than a bachelor’s in theology when under oath.
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
I genuinely feel sorry for Dr. David Tee, whose real name is Derrick Thomas Thiessen. A former college-trained Christian Missionary and Alliance preacher, Thiessen has constructed for himself a Christian gospel that bears no resemblance to the gospel found in the Bible or that which is believed by Evangelical Christians everywhere. Thiessen finally declaring his heretical gospel helps me understand his thinking and some of the bizarre things he has said in the past. Many of the readers of this blog are former Evangelicals. As you read Thiessen’s gospel, ask yourself, does this resemble anything you heard in church or preached as a pastor? Let me know your thoughts in the comment section.
Anyone, thieves, murderers, children, adults, LGBTQ members, atheists, and more people are all welcome to accept Christ as their savior. The only aspect of human life NOT invited or included in this plan or paradise is sin.
Every person who wants to go to God’s paradise has to give up their sin and practice it no more. Sin is not allowed in God’s home. The knowledge of sin is clearly defined and well documented as well as proclaimed.
Everyone knows God’s definition of what is sin and what is holy behavior. There is no secret and everyone has access to the Bible. They can read it for themselves if no one does it for them. [The Bible says the natural man CANNOT understand the things of God.] Those definitions do not change and humans cannot change it or add to them.
The definitions are clear and understandable so that no one has an excuse if they do not give up sin and live by God’s rules.
….
People look to get away from God through these false ideologies like diversity and inclusiveness yet those false ideologies only remind people that like God there are always rules and not everyone is going to like them.
….
If people want to go to God’s home and paradise, they must abide by God’s rules. There is no way around this fact. Only God can change those rules and he won’t as he remains the same. The rules are the rules and you need to accept that if you want a chance to live for eternity and avoid hell.
No matter how nice a person you think you are, you still need to accept Jesus as your savior and give up all sins and the practice of it to make it o heaven. There will be many famous people who have lived good and moral lives but they won’t make it to heaven.
The reason for that is the rule for salvation. Being good and moral is not the criteria to make it to heaven. [Isn’t stopping all sin being good and moral?] The rule to make it to heaven is to accept Christ as your savior and live by his rules. As Jesus said, why do you call me lord yet do not do the things I say (quoted from memory). [Jesus also said “there is none that doeth good, no not none.”]
The Bible also says that obedience is better than sacrifice. While those good and moral people may sacrifice sin and unethical behavior, they did not obey the rule for salvation. Thus they cannot expect to make it to heaven.
This is fair and just as the rules for salvation apply to everyone and that is very inclusive and diverse.
I am sure that Thiessen will say I misrepresented him, but the aforementioned words are his, not mine. What I read is a works-based gospel that is antithetical to salvation by grace. If perfection — the forsaking of all sin — is required for salvation and entrance into the eternal Kingdom of God, Heaven will be void of human life. No Christian, including Thiessen, will make it. I encourage David to really rethink what he believes, especially in light of his own sinful behavior. He better hope salvation is by grace. If not, he’s going to be burning in Hell with the very people he routinely condemns for behavior he deems sinful.
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
I ate a peanut butter and jelly sandwich an hour ago — Jiff creamy peanut butter, strawberry jam, on Aunt Millie’s buttermilk bread. Undoubtedly, the voyeur Dr. David Tee, whose real name is Derrick Thomas Thiessen, will soon write a scathing blog post about Welch’s grape jelly being the only God-approved jelly. Tee is a lazy writer who often co-opts the work of others instead of writing original posts. Both Ben Berwick and I are his favorite targets. We really wish he would move on to other targets, but he won’t. In my case, he is bound and determined to let the world know that I am wrong, even if his “world” has ten inhabitants.
Tee writes about me several times every week. He refuses to use my name or link to this site. Both of these behaviors violate Internet/blogging norms, but he doesn’t care. Typically, I ignore his posts, but on occasion, I will respond to his nonsense (or his bigotry, homophobia, or support for child predators).
These are going to grow as unbelievers become bolder. Since we use the BG website we are using an example from that content here:
“This is the latest installment in the Sacrilegious Humor series. This is a series that I would like readers to help me with. If you know of a comedy bit that is irreverent towards religion, makes fun of religion, pokes fun at sincerely held religious beliefs, or challenges the firmly held religious beliefs of others, please email me the name of the bit or a link to it.”
The latest installment is using some comedy routine by George Carlin. We are well aware of his views on religion and Christianity, etc., and have listened to many of them. A militant atheist we know had one of his comments in his signature on an archaeology discussion forum we participated in years ago.
The problem with Mr. Carlin’s point of view is that he looks at the world after sin and corruption entered. Then he blames God for the problems everyone faces or has faced since the beginning of time.
Like most unbelievers and former Christians, he blames God for the mess even though God had nothing to do with the mess. Also like unbelievers and former Christians, he doe snot take the time to find the real criminal who is responsible for the mess the world is in.
They also do not honestly look at what God DID do. They ignore that like they ignore evil and accuse God of things he did not do while the real criminal gets off scot-free and is able to continue to deceive people and either ruin their faith or keep people from accepting Christ as their savior.
Number one, that is not fair and number two, that point of view is not honest. As you can see by that quote, the owner of that website is looking for more material to attack or encourage the attacking of believers.
That is not right either. If BG does not want to be a Christian, that is his choice. He should remain silent and not encourage others to follow his path or attack Christians. Christians are only trying to help unbelievers escape sin and hell.
That is not anything that someone should rise up and attack Christians and extension God, Jesus, and the Bible. Stopping spiritual aid to those in spiritual need is equal to some dictators who stopped food shipments destined to help their starving people.
There are numerous problems with Tee’s post, including bad theology and a heretical understanding of the sovereignty of God, but I want to focus on the last three paragraphs:
Number one, that is not fair and number two, that point of view is not honest. As you can see by that quote, the owner of that website is looking for more material to attack or encourage the attacking of believers.
That is not right either. If BG does not want to be a Christian, that is his choice. He should remain silent and not encourage others to follow his path or attack Christians. Christians are only trying to help unbelievers escape sin and hell.
That is not anything that someone should rise up and attack Christians and extension God, Jesus, and the Bible. Stopping spiritual aid to those in spiritual need is equal to some dictators who stopped food shipments destined to help their starving people.
According to Tee, I am unfair and dishonest. In fact, I have been more than fair to an interlocutor who has done nothing but attack me, call me names, and lie about me. I offered to let him write a guest post. He declined. I offered to debate him. He declined. He is not banned from commenting on this site, but he refuses to do so. Instead, he removed comments from his blog so no one could respond to his writing. Tee is only interested in preaching, not dialog.
When it comes to honesty, Tee defines dishonesty as any belief that is different from his. He has established himself as the final authority on the Bible, Christianity, archeology, biology, and sex positions. Okay, maybe not the last one. 🙂 Long-time readers have heard me say many times: certainty breeds arrogance. Tee, a Christian Missionary & Alliance trained Fundamentalist, is the epitome of this arrogance. I have been interacting with him for over two years. I have yet to see him change his mind one time. When you are right, you are right, right?
Is my goal to attack Christians? Of course not. Scores of Christians regularly read my writing. Unfortunately, Tee thinks his peculiar brand of Evangelicalism = True Christianity. The focus of my work is Evangelical Christianity. Sadly, Evangelicalism is rife with beliefs, practices, personal behaviors, and people that are worthy of ridicule and mockery. The idea that religion must not be made fun of is absurd. I refuse to grant religion that kind of authority in my life. I respect individual believers — or try to, anyway — but their beliefs and practices? I respect that which is worthy of my respect. If Evangelicals don’t like being ridiculed, I suggest they change their ways (and let me be clear, some atheists are worthy of ridicule too).
I want to rewrite one of Tee’s paragraphs. Tee said:That is not right either. If BG does not want to be a Christian, that is his choice. He should remain silent and not encourage others to follow his path or attack Christians. Christians are only trying to help unbelievers escape sin and hell.
That’s not right either. If Derrick Thiessen doesn’t want to be an atheist (or Catholic, Buddhist, or Hindu), that is his choice. He should remain silent and not encourage others to follow his path or attack atheists. Atheists are only trying to help Christians escape irrationality and ignorance; to encourage them to embrace the only life they will ever have.
Checkmate.
Let’s try the same thing with the next paragraph. Tee wrote: “That is not anything that someone should rise up and attack Christians and extension God, Jesus, and the Bible. Stopping spiritual aid to those in spiritual need is equal to some dictators who stopped food shipments destined to help their starving people.”
That is not anything that someone should rise up and attack atheism/humanism and by extension skepticism, reason, and rationality. Stopping aid to those in intellectual need is equal to some Evangelical preachers who refuse to let their parishioners read books and websites that might challenge their beliefs and worldview; information that is meant to help people starving from a lack of knowledge.
Checkmate.
What we have here is a clash of worldviews. I am more than willing to interact with Tee and any other Evangelical on our competing worldviews, but Tee isn’t interested in such things. And neither are most Evangelical preachers. They know what they know, but, unfortunately, they are unable to fathom being wrong. Tee’s favorite quote comes from the movie Matilda:
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
Over the past week, Dr. David Tee, a Fundamentalist preacher whose real name is Derrick Thomas Thiessen, unleashed two vitriolic rants about transgender women on his blog. You can read his posts and my response here and here. Showing his inability to feel shame, Thiessen unleashed yet another post today about transgender women.
The Netherlands just happens to be the most recent country to say: The best-looking woman is…. a MAN.[Subjectively, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. There is no objective standard for “best-looking woman (or man.) ]
If this problem was not so serious [It’s not, but Tee is convinced, despite evidence to the contrary, that transgender women (and LGBTQ people in general) are an existential threat to Western civilization Transgender demographics], we [I] would be laughing not only at this contestant but all those who support it. What partial;y [sic] bothers [how is someone partially bothered?] us [me] is that the real women [heterosexual] in this and other contests are not feeling insulted by this decision. [Maybe because they aren’t homophobic bigots as Tee is?] Nor are the rest of the women in the world.
This is a very serious insult [No, I suspect most women think being called a bitch or cunt to their face is a serious insult.] made against [heterosexual] women. To think that a man pretending to be a woman is declared the most beautiful [beauty is not the only criterion for winning a beauty contest.] in the Netherlands or other countries that allow fake [transgender] women to enter these contests.
We [I] saw the 1st runner-up and there is no way [again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder] that the ‘winner’ was more beautiful than her. [Why is Tee watching beauty pageants to start with? Personally, I am not a fan. Is not Tee lusting by looking at other women in this matter? Besides, I thought inner beauty is what Evangelicals valued most?] It is a travesty and a tragic turn of events to allow a pretender [transgender woman] to get the throne [crown]. However, we [I] cannot laugh because [I get a boner every time I watch a beauty pageant] this [transgender] person and many like him [her] as well as their [her] supporters are just thinking about evil and doing evil just like it was in the days of Noah. [Evidently, Tee is a mind reader. He is usurping God, is he not, when he says he knows what is in the hearts of transgender women and their supporters? Of course, there was no such thing as the “days of Noah.” Genesis is fiction, David. How many times do I need to tell you this?]
They [Transgender women] are also not getting the mental health therapy [because many of them don’t need it. And those who do have a hard time paying for it or finding a therapist trained in their specific needs.] Because the liberals, democrats, and others on the left champion the so-called [actual, constitutional] rights of these mentally ill [everyday, ordinary people], they are barred from receiving the proper help [Biblical counseling, reparative therapy, casting out of demons].
No [bigoted, homophobic] Christian should be happy with this situation as these contests insult your wives, daughters, mothers, and sisters. They also rob those and other women of opportunities and awards that are rightfully theirs. [What, to win a fucking crown or get their 15 minutes of fame? I have a wife, sister, daughters, and daughters-in-law. Not one of them thinks a beauty pageant-winning transgender woman has robbed them of anything. Tee is projecting his homophobic bigotry on heterosexual women.]
It is not Christian love, loving your neighbor, or loving others as Jesus loved [Jesus had absolutely nothing to say about LGBTQ people. Tee knows this, but he projects his homophobic bigotry on Jesus too.] when you support these mentally ill people [transgender women]. Then allow them to practice their delusions in public as well as include them in events they have no right entering.
Supporting these people is not making a healthy society but destroying it.
“They treat us as monsters.” They are monsters for only a monster would mutilate their bodies [gender reassignment surgery] and let their delusions rule their lives. [Many transgender people never have gender reassignment surgery.] Only monsters would ruin events for innocent real women and erase women from society. [OMG! Transgender women are “erasing” heterosexual women from society? Compare the number of transgender women in America — less than one percent — to the number of heterosexual, lesbian, and bisexual women. Why, this is akin to saying Mauritius is an existential threat to the United States.]
But as Christians, we are to treat them like we want to be treated thus these people need to be sent to therapy [forced reeducation camps], and barred [locked up in prison] from entering mainstream society until they are cured of their delusions. They are not to be supported in this manner but housed, fed, and treated like human beings who are sick and in need of a doctor.
At no time can we support their desires because those desires are sinful, wrong, and not biblical [The United States and Western society, for the most part, are secular. What the Bible says plays no part in law and governance.] They harm innocent women through their inclusion and demands to be included and seen as women [the record is skipping, David. Bump the record player]. There is nothing Christian in them that can be supported. [Of course, the same can be said about Tee; a man who abandoned his family; a man who fled the United States to avoid legal problems; a man who didn’t pay child support for his child; a man who routinely shows no evidence of the fruit of the Spirt and daily ignores and disobeys Jesus’ teachings on how to treat transgender women.]
They need proper spiritual help to overcome these fantasies. They also need to be banned from all things related to women. [Jesus, talk about being all Hitler-like about transgender women.] The reverse is true if there are women pretending to be men. [Tee wants all transgender people to be incarcerated until they are “cured.”]
While we [I] do not condone hate messages or threats [liar, liar, pants on fire], we [I] also do not like these people forcing their delusions on society. [Using Tee’s illogical logic, how are transgender women any different from Evangelicals who try to force their delusions on society? Should we have them arrested and incarcerated until they are cured of their delusions?] Or forcing society to accept their pretend identities are normal. They are not normal but deep cries for help.
Including them in these and other female events is NOT providing the help they need. We need to protect our women from this psychological invasion of those who cannot accept themselves for who they are and how God made them.
The LGBTQ preferences are sinful, not normal, not biblical and not to be supported or accepted. The only thing we can do with and for these people is to treat them as Jesus would and get them the correct help they need [and arrest and incarcerate them until they see the “light.”]
— end of quote —
Please share your thoughts in the comment section. This should be fun! 🙂
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
Yesterday, Dr. David Tee, a Fundamentalist preacher whose real name is Derrick Thomas Thiessen, unleashed a vitriolic rant about transgender women on his blog. You can read his post and my response here. Showing his inability to feel shame, Thiessen unleashed yet another post about transgender women — one more awful than the first.
Two days ago we wrote an article called ‘Let’s Cut the Bull’ and as usual we got a response from one of the two people [Bruce Gerencser and Ben Berwick] we use as examples. But we are not going to deal with his complete response [because we have no defense for our hateful words], just one sentence.
That sentence tells everyone that he and the other guy do not do research, listen to the news, or in any way pull their heads out of the sand to see what is going on in the real world. We include both here because we have had to deal with the same problem from both of them– they do not do any real or honest research before speaking. [Please read Thiessen’s complete post if you want to see his “research.” What you will find is a list of anecdotes.]
please provide empirical evidence for the claim that transgender women are materially hurting heterosexual women and girls (BG website)
Those words were placed in brackets or parenthesis if you like the more technical term, behind these words- We cannot sit on the sidelines on this issue as they are hurting you if they hurt your wife or your female children [Thiessen provided no empirical evidence that this is systemically happening — just a handful of anecdotes].
There is a deep cost to women [please provide empirical evidence for this claim] by allowing men pretending to be women to exist in normal society. We will have to deal with this in two parts as one is physical harm which has reached the news frequently.
The other is more psychological as fake [transgender] women continue to do damage to real [heterosexual] women and girls.
….
We do not want to use the word transgender here because these men are not real women and should not be identified as being able to make a transition that is impossible to make. [Picture Thiessen standing on a corner, ears stopped up and hands over his eyes, saying, “I don’t see any transgender people. He is deliberately ignorant of what is right in front of him. Transgender people have always existed, going as far back as the third century. Some scholars argue that eunuchs in the Bible are intersex people. I wonder if Thiessen read Transgender History and What Does the Bible Say About Transgender People? My money is on NO! Thiessen’s typical “research” is seeking out articles that prove his point or agree with him. Fundamentalists don’t do actual scholarly research. Their minds are already made up. Certainty breeds arrogance, and the result is Thiessen’s anti-transgender posts.]
….
Men are stronger than [some] women no matter what changes they have made to their bodies. it is not Christian [Bible verse, please] to support this inclusion in female athletics. [I agree. Let’s have an actual discussion about transgender women participating in athletics with biological women. Of course, Thiessen doesn’t want to have a discussion. All he wants to do is preach. If he would bother to pay attention, he would find out that many transgender women have their own misgivings about participating in sports with biological women. Thiessen can’t know this because he’s never spoken to an actual transgender person.]
….
This damage can be as devastating [please provide empirical evidence for your claim] as physical damage done by fake [transgender] women. Women have had it rough since the beginning of time [thanks to misogynistic men such as Thiessen] and this so-called better modern era [Derrick pines for the good old days of the 1950s] where equal rights [evidently, Thiessen thinks women shouldn’t have equal rights] have been established is not doing any better than when women were considered property. [Did Thiessen really say women are no better off today than when they were chattel property? Really? I mean, really?]
The effort to be ‘inclusive’ has only succeeded in proving that [some] biological men are biologically stronger than [some] women. It has done nothing but harm women in a variety of ways [which are? Come on, Derrick, unleash your inner bigot]. You will not find one Bible verse condoning or giving permission for this type of inclusion [and we won’t find Bible verses for all sorts of human behaviors].
….
Other psychological abuses that fake women do to real women come through bullying [bullying takes place in every cohort].
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They [biological women] are outcasts and pariahs [I am rolling on the floor laughing at this absurd statement] as the fake [transgender] men and women have chosen an abnormal path that cannot be accepted as normal or right. The only reason the fake [transgender] women and their supporters fear real [heterosexual] men and women is because the truth of the latter destroys the delusions of the former and makes them realize that they have been deceived.
….
The fake [transgender] men and women are forced to see that they are not who they pretend to be and then must deal with the truth. The author of that quote was deceived by the outward appearance of the fake [transgender] men and women she met in San Francisco.
We [I] say deceived because even bad people can be nice. One guy, and we [I] forget where we [I] read this account but it is not original with us [me], said that when he got a job as a corrections officer in one prison one of his thoughts was he would be able to tell child molesters from regular criminals and people.
He was surprised at how nice and polite those child molesters were and how easy it was for them to be accepted as normal men and fit into regular society. Being nice and kind is not always a sign of a Christian as evil does masquerade as angels of light as the Bible says. [In other words, transgender people might be nice and kind, but in their hearts, they are like child molesters.]
….
This issue is not about a threat to one’s identity but about how completely wrong it is to allow these fake [transgender] men and women to think the way they do and then let them into normal society like nothing is wrong. [Thiessen believes transgender people should be arrested and incarcerated (and perhaps, executed). He does not believe the same about heterosexual rapists and child molesters. He thinks all they need to do is repent and get right with God.]
….
Sure, a woman can take chemicals to boost their testosterone and strength, as well as mutilate their bodies to look like a man. BUT that act does not change the truth or reality.
There are only 2 genders and only 2 gender identities. [Again, Thiessen deliberately confuses biological sex and gender. This is what happens when the Bible is your science textbook.] You are either a man or a woman and neither can change that fact. Not only is this biblical as the Bible tells us God made male and female only, but it is also proven scientifically [this is a lie].
Science backs the Bible in this case. Those who think they can change their gender and those that support this delusion are the ones with the problem. They need help [Jesus] and it is up to the Christians to not only provide the truth but also provide the correct spiritual help to lead these deceived people back to reality.
It is not Christian to allow these [transgender] people to harm women, invade women’s athletics and other events and it is definitely not Christian to go along with this deception. Christians should recognize this as a spiritual problem [please provide Bible verse that says being transgender is a “spiritual” problem. I can provide Bible verses, Derrick, that say divorce, failing to provide for your children, and abandoning one’s family are sins. I will be glad to share them with you if they are not in your Bible.] that needs the correct spiritual effort to heal these deceived groups of people.
….
Telling someone they are deceived and wrong, as well as doing the wrong thing is not a phobia or fear of something. Nor is it bigotry. It is trying to get those who adopt this trend to see the truth about themselves and what God has done at creation. [Thiessen is responding to me calling him a homophobe and a bigot. I stand by my words.]
Just as a side note, the lead-in that caught our attention is wrong. trans women are not real women. They are fake women who have a mental illness that is spiritual in nature and they are in need of help.
….
The so-called trans women do not have one body part [come on, Derrick, say it: penis or vagina] or process [what is a process?] that a real woman has. They [transgender women] are never going to be woman no matter how much money they spend on cosmetics and surgery. The reverse is true for those women trying to be men through this trend.
— end of quote —
Please share your thoughts in the comment section. This should be fun! 🙂
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
Over the weekend, Fundamentalist preacher Dr. David Tee, whose real name is Derrick Thomas Thiessen, unleashed a rant about transgender women. I will leave it to readers to respond to his homophobic rant.
Here’s what Thiessen had to say in a post titled Let’s Cut the Bull [I can’t believe Thiessen cursed] :
Why are feminists, who fought for equal rights for decades, not saying anything? This is one of the major comments we see when we read the comment section under different articles about transgender activity in women’s athletics and other events.
Maybe like those women whose rights have been trampled by the rush to support mentally ill transgender its [catch that? “its], they are afraid to speak out against a minute minority because of the harmful backlash that occurs.
What is this ‘historic moment’ telling everyone else in the world? That the Netherlands beauty pageant officials feel that the prettiest woman in their country is a man disguised as a woman [yes, and Thiessen is an asshole disguised as a Christian].
If we [I] were women [a woman], we [I] would be highly insulted by this decision as well as protesting the win. Yet, we [I] have not read or heard any woman’s group speaking out against this travesty. It is their competition and their prizes that are being taken by this IT and those that support it.
Are these women groups so flabbergasted that they cannot speak? The audacity of this decision to let a man win a woman’s competition deserves more vocal outrage than what we have seen.
This is not a new insult. In the article, it has been recorded as happening in other countries and at least one state in America. Those decisions came a few years ago giving the women’s groups ample opportunity to frame their arguments and build a strong protest against these moves.
Allowing a transgender to compete is NOT loving your neighbor because only 1 neighbor seems to be loved while the many other contestants and all the women of the world are harmed.
If you want to love your transgender neighbor, then get them mental health counseling and refuse to enroll them in different sports and events reserved for real women. [I agree, Derrick. PLEASE get professional help.]
There will be supporters of the transgender crowd that will talk about the rights of the transgendered person. However, the transgendered person already had rights under their biological birth gender.
This is called special rights because it is allowing men to pretend to be women and gives them access to rewards and benefits many real women get access to. This is like the same-sex marriage issue.
People were saying that lesbian and male homosexuals have a right to marry the person they love. They already had that right to marry but the LG part of the LGBTQ community refused to follow the rules and demanded special rights [what special rights? Justice and equal protection under the law is the standard].
No, transgenders do not have the right to participate in women’s athletics or events. They are NOT women. To allow them to participate in such activities or even dress in women’s changing rooms, use women’s bathrooms, etc., is not only special rights but is also wrong.
We cannot afford to allow the unbelieving world to wipe out the lines between good and evil, right and wrong, moral and immorality. The latter they have been doing for decades as well by accepting adultery and pre-marital sex as normal behavior [says a man who has a few secrets in his closet].
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This is the excuse and one of the verses many sympathizers to the LGBTQ community use to support these perverted sexual practices. They use a few other verses as well. But they are misapplying and misunderstanding what those verses mean.
Loving your neighbor does not mean you trample the rights and privacy of the majority in favor of the minute minority or other wrongdoers. Loving your neighbor is not allowing perversions to enter the marriage institute, the church, or women’s events. [Derrick, how do transgender women harm you in any way? None that I can think of.]
Loving your neighbor is not affirming, accepting, or supporting that which is wrong. [Jesus said it was, Derrick. Read the Sermon on the Mount.] True loving your neighbor would be to stand firm and not let the boundaries between right and wrong, etc., be wiped out.
It means getting the proper help to the parents of and the actual child who thinks they are not the gender they were born as. Loving your neighbor means stopping people from sinning by their accepting, affirming, supporting, and encouraging sinful behavior. [Who the fuck are you, Derrick, to stop anyone from “sinning?” Mind your own damn business.]
Loving your neighbor does not mean leading people to sin and then calling it good. Loving your neighbor does not allow pretend men and women to expose themselves to those of the gender they pretend to be.
Loving your neighbor means protecting all your neighbors, not a select few who refuse to accept who they are and take great strides to lose themselves in the deception that plagues them.
If you want to help these people, get them to the right therapists [says a man who desperately needs therapy] who will not encourage this deception and seek to cure it. These people do have rights but it is not the rights they think they have. The rights they have belong to their biological gender not the mentally ill perception they have of themselves. [According to Thiessen, transgender are mentally ill.]
….
Intersex is not an indication that there are more than 2 genders [Yes, it is]. Genesis reminds us that there are only 2 genders when it says that God made them MALE & FEMALE [It also reminds us that there are multiple gods. Checkmate]. No mistakes were made at birth, and no misassignment was done at birth.
It is up to the person to accept who they were born as and fight off the deception used on people to confuse them about their gender. Let’s get this straight as well. DO NOT blame God for this condition or for your assumed gender identity. [God is sovereign, is he not?]
God did NOT create this condition. He may know who was going to be intersex or think that they were assigned the wrong gender at birth. If you want to be mad at anyone, be mad at evil who DID cause this problem. [Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.]
God HAS provided a cure but a lot of the time the cure is lost due to the unbelief of doctors, psychiatrists, therapists, and other adults or the unbelief of the parents. We cannot fail to mention those Christians who listen to unbelievers on this issue.
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Your gender and gender identity are decided from the moment of conception. The DNA inside the fertilized egg creates the baby that is to be born. There is nothing in the reproduction process that manipulates the DNA and changes the gender from a male to a female or vice versa. [Thiessen doesn’t understand the difference between sex and gender.]
Since God does not make mistakes [yet he drowned millions of mistakes in the flood], you were given the gender [sex] at birth you are supposed to be. While humans have free choice [not according to the Bible], that does not mean that their gender choices are free from being sinful and that includes gender identity.
Changing your gender or gender identity is not a biblical choice. It is a failure to accept who you truly are and exposes your rejection of that identity and desire to be something else [says a man who moved from the United States/Canada to South Korea/Philippines to be someone else]. Unfortunately, you cannot change your gender or gender identity [exactly, and that’s why some people are transgender].
You are either a male or a female and the serenity prayer [egads! Extra-Biblical source!] helps you understand what you are to do- accept the things you cannot change. The Bible is there to help you see the truth and help you accept who you are [slave owner and polygamist].
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We bring this theory [evolution] into the conversation because it is important to know something about it. If you are honest in your studies of this theory, you will notice one very glaring omission in all the lessons taught about this ‘life development process.’
There is no mechanism or source in the theory of evolution for gender development. There is also no source for corruption to take place if evolution were true. In other words, the existence of intersex, transgender thinking, etc., proves evolution false.
There is no source for corruption, death, illness, and other issues in the theory of evolution. No scientist has identified the origin location for these issues either. In other words, these things should not exist if evolution were true.
If evolution were true, there would be no sin or evil and we would be living with Noah and Moses right now with no fear of dying. An evolutionary scientist may claim that these issues came from animals but where did the animals get it?
There is absolutely no source for these issues in an evolutionary developed world. Evolution does not explain anything about this world. [These five paragraphs are the stupidest things Thiessen has ever written.]
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Men, we are charged with looking after women [you might want to ask women if they want looking after] and if the real women of this world are too afraid to speak out [something tells me Thiessen will learn that women are not afraid to respond to his nonsense] against this travesty and violation of their rights, etc., then we must do it for them [thank you, Derrick, for helping these poor, helpless women out].
We must lead the way and build strong arguments, and find real solutions to protect the women we love. We cannot place this ball in their court and have them go it alone. [Oh my, women would be helpless without men.] It is time, especially for Christian men, for men to stand up and do something about this attack on women. [Do what, Derrick? Come on, speak what is really on your mind. Tell us what you really want to do to transgender people. Arrest? Incarceration? Execution? Own your vile beliefs, Derrick. You know the Bible says fornicators, adulterers, and homosexuals should be executed. Oh wait, that means you would be executed too.]
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We cannot sit on the sidelines on this issue as they are hurting you if they hurt your wife or your female children [please provide empirical evidence for the claim that transgender women are materially hurting heterosexual women and girls], even in letting fake women ruin women’s athletics and other events. Take the leadership in this so that women do not lose their freedoms, their rights, and their identity. Make sure to lead them in the right way to go. [Yes, put bridles on these fillies and lead them in paths of righteousness. Let me know if you get kicked in the head.]
— end of quote —
Please share your thoughts in the comment section. This should be fun! 🙂
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
Dr. David Tee, whose real name is Derrick Thomas Thiessen, is a Christian Missionary & Alliance trained preacher. As Evangelical preachers are wont to do, Tee has cobbled together his own peculiar version of Christianity and what it means to be a True Christian®. I have read enough of Tee’s posts to know that he can, at times, promote heretical beliefs — heretical when measured by core Evangelical beliefs about salvation by grace. There are times when it seems he is preaching salvation by works — a soteriology that can certainly be justified with the Bible (as all soteriologies can).
In a post titled Can Christianity Help With Politics? Tee posits that “There are many benefits to having true Christians run governments.” Tee goes on to give his definition of a True Christian®:
By true Christians, we mean those that correctly follow Christ.
According to Tee, a True Christian® is someone who “correctly” follows Christ. What does it mean to “correctly” follow Jesus? What does Tee mean when he uses the word “correctly?” I assume he thinks a person must believe and do certain things to be a True Christian. I know he believes transgender people can’t be True Christians®, but Evangelical preachers who rape and sexually molest children are just True Christians® who need to humbly say “my bad, Jesus.”
Tee has made it clear that he is absolutely certain he is right in doctrine and deed. No one can correct him, especially unwashed, uncircumcised Philistines such as Bruce Gerencser. The moment I deconverted, I magically lost everything I know about the Bible, theology, and Christianity. Evidently, Gawd gives a Men in Black mind wipe to Christians the moment they deconvert. Of course, this is absurd.
There’s no such thing as True Christianity®. According to Pew Research, there are about 2.4 billion Christians in the world; 279 million in the United States. I suspect these numbers are grossly inflated, but we can conclude from them there are a lot of Christians in the world and in the United States. I live in rural northwest Ohio — the land of God, Trump, and Guns. God said humans can’t hide from him. Even in the depths of Hell, he is there. I feel the same way about Christianity. While American Christianity is in decline, there are few places I can go to escape Jesus and his merry band of followers. They are like a rash you can’t get rid of. (I am primarily speaking of Evangelicals and conservative Catholics. When I go out to dinner with the pastor of the local United Church of Christ, my rash magically goes away.)
Put one hundred Christians in a room and ask them to define core Christian beliefs and you will get a plethora of answers. You will find disagreement on salvation, sin, baptism, communion, creation, and other beliefs. Yet hardcore Fundamentalists such as Tee are certain that their beliefs and practices are straight from the mouth of God; that their interpretations of the Bible are absolutely right; that their beliefs are the standard by which all (alleged) Christians are measured.
These disagreements and internecine wars over what constitutes a True Christian® are a sure sign that Christianity is a human invention, or whatever Christianity might have been has been so obscured and adulterated by 2,000 years of organized Christianity that its essence has been lost.
Jesus told his followers that there were two great commandments: love God with all your heart, soul, and might, and love your neighbor as yourself. Pray tell, where can such a Christianity be found? Where can we find a preacher or church that takes seriously Jesus’ words in the Sermon on the Mount or his words in Matthew 25? From 1995-2002, I pastored Our Father’s House in West Unity, Ohio. I remember telling the congregation that Christianity (and the world) would be better served if we focused our energy on living out the teachings of Jesus found in the Sermon on the Mount; that we had become distracted from the essence of faith.
As Evangelicals and conservative Catholics wage unholy war against anyone and everyone who is different from them, I wonder if they stop to consider that maybe, just maybe, in their attempt to “Christianize” the world they have lost all sense of what it means to truly be a follower of Jesus (or a decent human being)?
As I have said countless times in my writing, certainty breeds arrogance. When Evangelicals are certain that their versions of God and Jesus are the right ones, and their interpretations of the Bible are infallible, there’s no way to reach them. But, Bruce, you were a Fundamentalist, and now you are not! Certainly, that is true, but it wasn’t until I entertained the possibility that I could be wrong that my mind was open to the possibility of change. Until then, I was certain I was right. Change is hard, and unless we humble ourselves before our own ignorance, we will never know how much we don’t know.
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
Dr. David Tee, whose real name in Derrick Thomas Thiessen, is a Christian Missionary & Alliance preacher without a church to pastor; a man who abandoned a child years ago and fled to the Philippines to avoid legal accountability; a thief who regularly uses content from this site without giving proper attribution; an obsessive-compulsive man when to comes to my writing and that of my British friend Ben Berwick. He cannot and will not stop molesting us.
Tee has written more than one hundred posts about me, and a substantial number of articles about Ben. Over the past six weeks, Tee has written a post that mentions me every few days. Ben has figured out how to completely block him from accessing his site, but I’ve been unable to do so. There was a time when I would respond to his attacks, lies, and mischaracterizations, but I no longer do so. I only respond now when he says something so egregious that I feel compelled to reply.
As you know, I’ve taken a break from writing. (We are going to a baseball game in Cincinnati on Monday.) I’ve been trying to catch up on a few things, especially emails and the Black Collar Crime Series. My goal this coming week is to get my podcast up and running. Imagine my surprise, then, to read this from Tee:
They [Ben Berwick and Bruce Gerencser]are never honest. The owner of the BG website [The Life and Times of Bruce Gerencser] said he was taking a break from writing, yet aside from 3 guest posts, he has published more articles since that notice went [where?] than any other given week he was writing.
Honesty and integrity are two things we do not expect from unbelievers. But we can call them cowards as their actions are just that, cowardly. The MM [Meerkat Musings] website owner [Ben Berwick] is exactly like the little boy who didn’t get his way and takes his ball and goes home.
He wants to call the shots even though he has no credibility, or legitimacy to call the shots. We laugh at him and his actions because he has not grown up but likes to bully those who are different from himself.
He is supposed to be an adult yet acts in the most childish manner. he should change the name of the website to chicken little. If we are being harsh it is because his actions exemplify everything we have just written.
We are getting more of a laugh than anything else and write this in a lighthearted manner even though he will make false accusations about us. He always does.
What a prick. Tee says he is a follower of Jesus, but his behavior says that he is anything but.
Most of the readers of this blog understand that I took a break from writing. The posts that have been published recently, don’t fall into that category. Sounds of Sacrilege, Sounds of Fundamentalism, and the Black Collar Crime Series? These series’ require very little work on my part. I use templates that allow me to push out content quickly. I have a big backlog of potential posts for these series. So, during my time away from writing, I’m trying to clear this backlog.
Of course, all Tee cares about is calling me a liar.
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
Above all else, remember this: You are right. They are wrong. You are coming from a superior position. You have God on your side. They don’t.
Never, never think about the possibility that you might sound arrogant and condescending when you keep asserting that God has led you to the real truth.
Accept uncritically and parrot the answers well-known Christian apologists give about challenges to belief. Never check these things out for yourself.
Do not listen to ex-Christians when they tell you why they left and how life feels after leaving faith. Turn off all curiosity about an ex-believer’s life experiences. Listen only to what the Bible tells you about why people leave and how it feels to them when they leave. This enables you to know more about how their lives feel than they do.
Always assume that individuals who never believed will be immediately convinced when you quote Bible verses as proof of your beliefs.
Ignore the feedback of ex-believers when you are quoting Bible verses to convince them, and they tell you you’re quoting verses they memorized or quoted when they were believers.
When someone surprises you by responding with a Bible passage that disagrees with your position, tell them they are not interpreting the passage correctly.
If you find out that an ex-believer has studied the Bible more than you, confidently assert they were never a true believer and consequently all their study was in vain.
If all your arguments fail, attack the character of the person who disagrees with you! Tell this individual that there’s no way his/her life can have meaning, and there’s no way s/he can live any kind of moral life. Top it off with the warning: “You’ll be sorry when you burn in hell!” And be sure to convey that you see that destiny as a just reward.
Remember that you’re not just an apologist for Christianity, you’re also an apologist for your brand of Christianity. Confront Christians whose theology is different from yours with the same intensity that characterizes your confrontations with atheists.
Funny stuff; sarcastic; not meant to be taken literally; a tongue-in-cheek jab at online Evangelical apologists. One online apologist, Dr. David Tee, whose real name is Derrick Thomas Theissen, thought these ten points were spot on. Why, he said AMEN, Brother Sledge, all the way from a basement somewhere in the Philippines.
Thiessen: There is nothing wrong with using the internet to further the kingdom of God but be careful as the rules of God still apply when you are a keyboard warrior In the following article, we are going to address 10 steps another believer has compiled to help other Christians be online warriors [that was not the unbelieving Sledge’s intention.].
Sledge: #1. Above all else, remember this: You are right. They are wrong. You are coming from a superior position. You have God on your side. They don’t.
Thiessen: This is true but with some caveats. You are right if you make sure you have the truth and do not assume you have it. Also, God is with us as long as you do not sin in your online work. Plus, Christians do not come from a superior position. We come from a humble one grateful that God has saved us and set us free from sin.
Sledge: #2. Never, never think about the possibility that you might sound arrogant and condescending when you keep asserting that God has led you to the real truth.
Thiessen: Sounding arrogant is not the same as being arrogant. What unbelievers do not understand is that once Christians have found the truth, they do not have to struggle or search for it. We have the truth and need to speak it in Biblical love. If it sounds arrogant or condescending to the unbeliever, that is because they come from a different viewpoint and they are deceived into thinking they are correct. [In other words, if I sound like a Christian asshole, that’s because unbelievers such as Bruce Gerencser are deceived.] However, some Christians are arrogant and condescending but that can be fixed with God’s help. This accusation is one where the unbeliever ignores the fact that they are arrogant and condescending when they trash the beliefs of Christians. It is a hypocritical complaint.
Sledge: #3. Accept uncritically and parrot the answers well-known Christian apologists give about challenges to belief. Never check these things out for yourself.
Thiessen: There is nothing wrong with this IF the well-known Christian apologist speaks the truth. We do not have to search for new information because the truth is the truth. You cannot expand on the truth. The only issue here is for those parroting Christians to make sure they have heard the truth. Just like the Bereans did in Acts. Once you confirm it as the truth, speak it all the time when it is appropriate to mention it. Just do not go into falsehood because the unbeliever will get upset. We are to speak the truth at all times.
Sledge: #4. Do not listen to ex-Christians when they tell you why they left and how life feels after leaving the faith. Turn off all curiosity about an ex-believer’s life experiences. Listen only to what the Bible tells you about why people leave and how it feels to them when they leave. This enables you to know more about how their lives feel than they do.
Thiessen: Ex-Christians have left the truth and are very vulnerable to the work of evil. As we have found over the years, the ex-Christians blame everyone else for their decisions except those most responsible for it– themselves and evil. While a few of them may have legitimate concerns, most are not. We have visited and read ex-pastor and ex-Christian websites and have seen them blame God and everyone else for their departure. Most of the time, they are at fault and not the church or Christians. The latter are just excuses for their decisions and the real problem is that the ex-Christian just does not want to follow God’s rules anymore.
….
Sledge: #5. Always assume that individuals who never believed will be immediately convinced when you quote Bible verses as proof of your beliefs.
Thiessen: This is the first legitimate complaint on this list. Many Christians do have this attitude. They forget that you have to plant, then water, and then finally harvest. Evangelism is a process and it starts with the Christian being a Christian to all people.
….
Sledge: #6. Ignore the feedback of ex-believers when you are quoting Bible verses to convince them, and they tell you you’re quoting verses they memorized or quoted when they were believers.
Thiessen: Nothing wrong with doing that. The verses are still true and it doesn’t matter if the ex-believer memorized them before they left the faith or not. What is important is that the ex-believer did not listen to those verses or implemented them in their lives. Their feedback only tells you this and their feedback should be ignored. They do not have the truth of those scriptures anymore and they are using this knowledge as a defense against the truth. In reality, they are ignoring what you are saying by using this defensive tactic. But we need to be careful of quoting scripture to ex-believers as they will trod the truth and pearls under their feet. [And they will also scoop up our bullshit and feed it back to us, one spoon at a time.[
Sledge: #7. When someone surprises you by responding with a Bible passage that disagrees with your position, tell them they are not interpreting the passage correctly.
Thiessen: Many Christians are surprised but generally, the ex-believer or unbeliever does not understand the passage correctly. The Bible does not contradict itself and every verse works together. When the unbeliever or ex-believer makes these quotes, they do not understand the Bible or how it is applied. Usually, they are interpreting the bible according to their sinful and subjective viewpoint and not using God’s objective view to get the right message. The Spirit of Truth is not with those who do not believe even if they were once believers. They do not know the truth. You can by following the Spirit of Truth to the truth. Then do not depart from the truth because someone uses the Bible against you and your knowledge.
Sledge: #8. If you find out that an ex-believer has studied the Bible more than you, confidently assert they were never a true believer and consequently, all their study was in vain
Thiessen: Yes, if they are an ex-believer, all of their biblical studies were in vain. The reason for saying that is that with all the knowledge and experience with Jesus they had, they still quit on Jesus. There is no other way to put it. They will not get to heaven just because they studied and memorized the bible. They gave up their salvation when they left the faith and that action makes all their previous work in vain. Whether they were a true believer or not should be left up to God to decide. We have to deal with the issues that confront us and not make judgments on their spiritual lives prior to their leaving the faith. Also, just because they studied the Bible more than you did does not mean they know or understand the Bible better than you. They no longer have the truth even if they are quoting scriptures. They threw everything away when they left the faith. No unbeliever or ex-believer can tell you the truth of what God’s word says. Even if they have a doctorate in biblical studies. [He’s talking about Dr. Bart Ehrman. Thiessen thinks he knows more about the Bible than all the unsaved scholars in the world — past and present.]
Sledge: #9. If all your arguments fail, attack the character of the person who disagrees with you! Tell this individual that there’s no way his/her life can have meaning, and there’s no way s/he can live any kind of moral life. Top it off with the warning: “You’ll be sorry when you burn in hell!” And be sure to convey that you see that destiny as a just reward.
Thiessen: Never attack the other person. Address their arguments and show them the error in their thinking. BUT NEVER attack the other person. You will notice that the only people Jesus insulted or attacked were the religious leaders of his time. But those attacks were also meant to be a lesson and an example to us as to how NOT to be. It was never permission to attack anyone who disagrees with us. believe it or not, most unbelievers already know they are going to hell, you do not need to remind them of that fact. As for ‘meaning and morality’, the unbeliever thinks they can be moral or have meaning as their definition of those aspects of life is different from the Christian. Many unbelievers who became Christians have stated that they did not have meaning in their lives before becoming Christians. [You might want to practice what you preach, Derrick. Dare I republish the nasty, hateful emails you sent me?]
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Sledge: #10 Remember that you’re not just an apologist for Christianity, you’re also an apologist for your brand of Christianity. Confront Christians whose theology is different from yours with the same intensity that characterizes your confrontations with atheists.
Thiessen: Always speak the truth. When you speak the truth it doesn’t matter if they are claiming ot be a Christian or an unbeliever, they cannot do anything against it. There is only one truth and only one true Christian faith [mine]. When you work for Christ on the internet or anywhere else, you are to bring the true Christian faith and the only truth. It does not matter if other denominations disagree with you, the truth [as interpreted by me] is the truth no matter what.
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Thiessen: In conclusion, when you do your online Christian work, make sure to do it in a manner that is glorifying to God. Not just that you think it is glorifying to God but that it actually is accomplishing that objective.
Thiessen: All points quoted above came from the article How to be an Online Evangelical Christian Apologist by Tim Sledge on the website we no longer link to. [In other words, I steal content from Bruce Gerencser’s website without providing proper attribution.]
Thiessen: We saw that there was a response to our article yesterday and as usual our English nemesis fille dit with distortions, etc. it is not worth responding to as it seeks to deflect the truth.
I wonder who Thiessen was talking about in his post? That’s a rhetorical question, by the way. If he is not talking about the Evangelical-preacher-turned- atheist Bruce Gerencser, he is talking about his other nemesis, Ben Berwick, AKA the English Meerkat. 🙂
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
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