Since my last post about “Dr. David Tee (David Thiessen, Theology Archeology, TEWSNBN), “Dr.” David Tee Continues to Obsess Over My Writing, the defender of Fundamentalist Christianity from a dank, poorly lit basement somewhere in the Phillipines has written six more posts that are either about me directly or mention me in passing.
Typically, I ignore Tee’s stalker-like obsession with me, but his next-to-last post about me (and atheists in general), Are Evangelicals Responsible for the Culture Wars? demands some sort of response from me. My response is indented and italicized. All spelling and grammar in the original.
The answer according to BG [ Tee is too lazy to type out my name] and other atheists seems to be a resounding ‘yes’. Just read his words as BG speaks for himself and other atheists:
“It seems that Donald can’t or won’t understand why atheists might want to challenge Evangelical beliefs, especially since those beliefs directly affect and harm unbelievers.”
This concept is held by atheists world wide. Instead of taking the blame for their own actions, it is easier and more convenient to blame someone else. The easiest target is the Evangelical or the RCC or some other protestant religion that goes against atheist ideals.
The history of the modern culture war is clear. One need only look at the history of the Moral Majority and other Evangelical groups who followed in their steps to see the people and beliefs behind the current iteration of the “culture war.” The same can be said of conservatives within Roman Catholicism and Mormonism. (Many other culture wars have been fought throughout America’s history — prohibition comes to mind, as does the pro-slavery movement. I am specifically talking about the post-Roe vs. Wade culture war.)
What behaviors, exactly, do atheists refuse to take responsibility for? Besides, there’s no such thing as “atheism” or the “religion of atheism.” Wikipedia defines atheism this way:
“Atheism, in the broadest sense, is an absence of belief in the existence of deities. Less broadly, atheism is a rejection of the belief that any deities exist. In an even narrower sense, atheism is specifically the position that there are no deities.”
Atheists are individuals. There’s no sect or church atheists belong to. Each atheist simply denies the existence of deities. That’s it.
There’s also no such thing as “atheist ideals.” Aside from their common belief about the non-existence of deities, atheists have all sorts of political and social beliefs. Sure, many atheists are humanists, holding liberal/progressive ideas. Others, however, are card-carrying conservatives, many of whom voted for Donald Trump.
It should go without saying that I do NOT represent all atheists. The only person I represent is Bruce Gerencser. Do many of the readers of this blog generally agree with me? Sure. But, more than a few of my atheist readers wish I wouldn’t write about politics. To suggest that I am representative of a typical atheist is not only untrue, but dishonest.
BG repeats himself and makes his accusation even clearer: “Evangelicals are the primary force behind the culture war.”
Then he goes on to list the ‘crimes’ [I do not use the word “crimes” in my post.] being committed by Evangelicals that not only supposedly started this culture war but fuels [sic] it. Those are strong words to hurl against a group of people who look to help everyone in the nation in which they live.
Evidently, Tee is responding to what I said in my second response to Donald, Yet Another Evangelical Asks Me Why I Am So Bitter — Part Two:
“I spent significant time in my first response to Donald explaining to him why I do what I do. It seems that Donald can’t or won’t understand why atheists might want to challenge Evangelical beliefs, especially since those beliefs directly affect and harm unbelievers. My God, we need only to look at the January 6 insurrection or the election of Donald Trump to see how Evangelicals harm others. Evangelicals are the primary force behind the culture war. These warriors for Jesus want to criminalize abortion, outlaw same-sex marriage, marginalize LGBTQ people, and establish a Christian theocracy where the Bible is the law of the land. These things materially cause harm, so it would be irresponsible for me not to speak out on these (and other) issues. I suspect Donald wants the freedom to do the same. Again, I ask why does Donald want privileges for Evangelicals that he is unwilling to grant to atheists, agnostics, humanists, pagans, and other unbelievers?”
Tee asserts that Evangelicals “look to help everyone in the nation in which they live.” Really? I mean, REALLY? Everywhere I look, I see Evangelicals who want to cause harm to others: women, LGBTQ people, immigrants, atheists, and Muslims to name a few. What religious sect is behind the current war against masks and vaccinations? What religious sect was front and center during the January 6, 2021 insurrection? What religious sect is threatening violence toward people who refuse to bow to their theocratic demands? What religious sect has forsaken following after Jesus for fascism? (I am, of course, speaking generally. I am well aware of the fact that there are Evangelicals who take seriously the teachings of Christ and love their neighbors as themselves. They are, however, the exception to the rule.)
Evangelicals are an existential threat to our Republic. Left to their own devices, blood will be shed, people will die, and the Christian flag will stand proud and tall above the U.S. flag at the Capitol. In their minds, there is no king but Jesus and no law but the Bible.
But when you look at the crimes Evangelicals are supposed to be guilty of it really makes you wonder where the minds of atheists are at. How is it wrong to stop abortion and make that act of murder illegal?
How is making abortion illegal a far worse crime than killing innocent people? If a Christian stops a man from killing a woman on the street he is praised, yet when it comes to protecting unborn children from their parents somehow that act of sparing a life is worse than the atrocities committed by Stalin, Mao, and Hitler put together.
Abortion is not murder, need I say more? Eighty-eight percent of abortions take place in the first trimester — sixty-five percent in the first eight weeks. If Tee cannot or will not see the difference between a zygote and a child, I don’t know what to tell him.
Here are twenty-five questions I have for anti-abortionists, also known as forced-birthers:
Does life begin at conception? How do you know it does? Is your view based on science or is it based on a religious belief?
If life begins at conception, why are you supporting an Ohio bill that makes it illegal to have an abortion once a heartbeat is detected? Does life begin at conception or at first heartbeat?
Do you support the use of emergency contraception (morning after) drugs? Why or why not?
Should a pro-life pharmacist have the right to not dispense emergency contraception drugs? Should I be allowed to opt out of anything that goes against my moral or ethical beliefs, regardless of their foundation?
Is abortion murder?
Do you believe murderers should be prosecuted?
Do you believe that driving the get-away car makes a person just as guilty as the person who robbed the bank?
Do you believe a woman who has an abortion should be prosecuted for murder? How about the doctor who performs the procedure? How about the nurse that assisted in the procedure? How about the person who drove the woman to the clinic? If you believe in the death penalty, do you support the execution of murderers?
Do you use birth control pills?
Should you be prosecuted for murder since birth control pills can, and do, cause spontaneous abortion?
Should abortion be allowed for reasons of rape, incest, or saving the life of the mother?
If you answered yes to question eleven, do you support murdering the fetus if it is the product of rape or incest?
Should a fetus be aborted if the mother’s life is at risk?
Do you support murdering the unborn if it saves the life of the mother?
Is your viewpoint on abortion a religious belief?
What passage in the Bible prohibits abortion? Does this passage define life beginning at conception?
Has God ever killed the unborn?
In Genesis, God destroyed every human save eight by drowning them in a flood. Were any of the women who drowned pregnant? Did God kill the fetuses they were carrying? (Kill the mother, kill the fetus.)
Do you support the death penalty? Do you support war? Should women who survive self-induced abortions be charged with attempted murder?
If you answered yes to question nineteen, why do you oppose the killing of the unborn but support the killing of those already born?
Why do you believe that killing the unborn is murder but consider an American bomb killing a baby 3 hours old a tragic result of war, collateral damage, but not murder?
Do you support birth control being readily available in every school? If your objective is to reduce or eliminate the need for an abortion, wouldn’t easily available, free access to birth control reduce the abortion rate?
Do you believe it is better for a severely deformed child to live for a day and die than for the fetus to be aborted? If so, explain why it is better for the child to suffer needlessly?
Do you believe that God is in control of everything? Does everything include children being born deformed or with serious defects that will result in a life of extreme suffering and pain?
Is someone a Christian if he or she supports abortion?
I’m sure Tee will take these questions as some sort of test for him to answer. Can’t wait for that. (That’s sarcasm, by the way.)
Obviously, atheists have a warped sense of what is fueling these so-called culture wars. The same questions can be put to the support of same-sex marriage.
How is it wrong to stop people from being perverts, mocking traditional marriage, and wanting to preserve that rite of life for everyone? Why should an institution become a laughingstock simply because some people do not want to follow the rules of marriage that have been in place since the beginning of time?
Where is the crime in limiting the institution to only those who will follow the rules? There is no law stating that same-sex couples cannot love each other outside of marriage.
However, there are certain rules in place that prohibit non-married partners from benefiting from certain aspects of life when a same-sex partner dies, is injured, and so on. To change those rules one does not have to destroy the institution of marriage but the LGBTQ community doesn’t care about that.
They are very selfish and only think of their own selves. It is not the Evangelical that fired the first shot in this battle and they have the right to defend the institution of marriage and keep it holy, sanctified, and pure.
After all, it is the sick and perverted that is invading the domain of marriage and they were not invited to join. In this case, the LGBTQ community is the one to blame for the war over marriage.
Tee says LGBTQ people are sick, selfish, and perverted. That should tell you all you need to know about the man. Thou doth protest too much, “Dr.” Tee.
Marriage is a state-sanctioned contract between two people. The state grants certain privileges to people who enter into such contracts. Tee can provide no rational reason outside of quoting the Bible to prohibit two people of the same sex from marrying. Their marriages do not affect Tee and his fellow moralizers in any way. What drives Tee’s outrage is his lifelong homophobia (and perhaps latent desire for gay sex). Tee covers up his homophobia with moral pronouncements and Bible verses, but make no mistake about it, underneath his facade is a homophobe (and I am using the word in a colloquial sense).
Then BG states the next crime to be marginalize LGBTQ people, yet how so? He does not go into detail here and in reality, homosexuals were never really marginalized. One of the codebreakers of the German enigma machines was a homosexual.
They got to help in the War and they got to work, live in homes, and so on. People draw the line when special rights are being granted. The selfish and greedy reach of the LGBTQ knows no boundaries.
….
Oh my, LGBTQ people get to serve in the military, have jobs, and own homes — rights Tee would deny to them if he and his fellow theocrats were in charge. LGBTQ people demand equal rights and protection under the law. Instead of thinking about anal sex all the time, I suggest Tee ponder why it is right to deny LGBTQ citizens the same rights heterosexual Americans have? What legal basis is there for denying LGBTQ people the same civil rights everyone else has? LGBTQ people want equal rights, not superior rights — unlike Evangelicals with their Christian nation beliefs.
But these crimes may only be the smoke screen for the most important ‘crime’ held against the evangelical- establish a Christian theocracy where the Bible is the law of the land.
What is being said here is that the atheist really wants to make their own rules and live by them. They do not want to humble themselves and say to God, ‘okay, we will obey you…’ They want to be masters of the world and live their own ways.
They do this regardless of how much harm and hurt their alternative lifestyles do to other people. It is not the Christian or Evangelical that is harming people, it is the atheist.
….
Well, at least Tee finally admits he is a Christian nationalist.
Everyone is being hurt by the atheist support of the LGBTQ agenda.
Who is being hurt and how? How does wanting equal rights and protection under the law for everyone cause harm to others? No answers will be forthcoming
Finally, the atheist and their fellow unbelievers have not created a great society to live in with their rules.
Crime is out of control, injustice is being done daily, people are being killed, shot, robbed far more now than when God’s rules were on the books. Also, criminals are not being punished for their crimes. How is this better than a God-centered nation?
Uh, the overwhelming majority of Americans are Christian. Christians control the levers of government and the U.S. Supreme Court. If crime is out of control (and it’s not) who is to blame? Most of the crime committed in this country is committed by people who believe in the existence of the Christian God, and who, to some degree or another, believe the Bible is the Word of God. Surely, Tee doesn’t think it’s atheists commiting most of the crimes in this country?
Tee lives in a dystopian Christian alternate reality, one where atheists roam the land murdering, raping, stealing, and burning churches to the ground. Much like many of his fellow Evangelicals, Tee has a persecution complex extraordinaire — detached from reality.
When you look closely at the facts, the atheist is merely blaming Christians for what they are actually doing.
Please provide those “facts” you are talking about, David. We would all love to look at them “closely.”
Oh, and the atheist says that those who make extraordinary claims need to produce the physical evidence to support those claims. Well. BG says God does not exist, there is no sin, and many other anti-biblical claims. He has yet to produce any real physical evidence to support his extraordinary claims.
I am an agnostic atheist, David. You know this. So, please quit misrepresenting my views. Sin? A religious construct used to induce fear, keeping asses in the pews and money in the offering plates. My real “evidence” can be found in the almost 4,000 posts on this site. Feel free to rage blog away, David. In fact, I encourage you to start a new blog with the express purpose of deconstructing my writing. Or, you can continue to whine and complain over my refusal to accept your irrational, unscientific, immoral, anti-human claims.
We challenge him to do so on his blog instead of declaring how many years he has been in ministry, how many sermons he has preached, or how he has trouble going to the bathroom (way too much information there).
The solution to your existential angst David is this: don’t read my blog. I have explained to you why I use autobiographical statements in my writing several times. Yet, you continue to whine about me doing so. I have come to the conclusion that you are jealous. You have come out on the losing end of a dick-measuring contest and don’t like it. You don’t like the fact that I have garnered a large following over the years. Instead of plowing your own fields, you stand along the fence row complaining about my farming techniques. You, my friend, are a petty man.
You are the only person who has ever complained about my use of autobiographical material or mentions of my health problems. Why is that, David? Let me state once again: you are a petty man.
Why are you so opposed to natural bodily functions such as sex and shitting? I assume you do both. If you don’t want to talk about your fucking and pooping, fine. However, I will continue to do so. Maybe I’ll even share photos. You can use them free of charge. 😂 Don’t like it? Don’t read my blog.
On a side note, BG has this to say:
“If Donald has not done so, I encourage him to read one or more of Dr. Bart Ehrman’s books on the history and nature of the Biblical text.”
We know [a real Dr. unlike you] Bart Ehrman through his books, lectures, and debates. How could anyone think he has the truth about the Bible? He makes a lot of declarations but we are yet to see him produce any hard, verifiable, physical evidence that any of his declarations are true.
….
His books are the same way. It is all his point of view not facts from archaeology or history. All you get from Bart Ehrman is lies and misrepresentations.
sigh
Let’s see, “Dr.” David Tee’s books have sold how many copies, exactly? Surely Tee will provide his sales numbers for all to see? Something tells me his sales numbers will be 2,000,000 books less than Dr. Ehrman’s.
Tee thinks that by slanderously attacking Bart Ehrman he can get at me. After all, I’m a fanboy and I frequently suggest Evangelicals read Dr. Ehrman’s books.
Most Evangelicals believe the Bible is inerrant and infallible. Tee most certainly does, though I suspect he thinks his interpretations are superior to the original text. He is the pope of Evangelicalism. He’s never been wrong about a-n-y-t-h-i-n-g.
You can’t honestly read Dr. Ehrman’s books and come away believing the Bible is without error. If facts and evidence matter, inerrancy (as typically defined by Evangelicals) has to go. Tee “says” he had read Ehrman’s books, yet never mentions them on his site. I suspect he is overstating his Ehrman prowess. Tee remains a staunch defender of inerrancy, so either he hasn’t read Ehrman’s books or his “faith” stands in the way of intellectual honesty. One can certainly remain, as many have, a Christian after reading Ehrman’s books, but inerrancy cannot be rationally sustained.
Saved by Reason,
Bruce Gerencser, 67, lives in rural Northwest Ohio with his wife of 46 years. He and his wife have six grown children and sixteen grandchildren. Bruce pastored Evangelical churches for twenty-five years in Ohio, Texas, and Michigan. Bruce left the ministry in 2005, and in 2008 he left Christianity. Bruce is now a humanist and an atheist.
Your comments are welcome and appreciated. All first-time comments are moderated. Please read the commenting rules before commenting.
You can email Bruce via the Contact Form.
Oh no! DDT wants you to stop being mean and saying vulgar things on your blog, after you forced him to read it. And then he does pull out his Christian National flag. I wouldn’t want to be around him if he got his way and Christians forced everyone to do what they want. He certainly seems like the type to be happy to persecute and even execute us evil non-Christians. All in the name of God’s love, of course.
And quicker and smellier than a fart in an elevator Tee responds:
https://theologyarchaeology.wordpress.com/2021/12/11/responding-to-a-response/
So damn predictable. 😂😂
He concludes:
“Then in passing, BG says that ‘we are never wrong’ etc. No, God is never wrong and we just have a simple desire to find the truth. God leads us to the truth. So it may seem like we are not wrong but in reality we learn a lot and go through a lot of changes in that process.
We tried to understand BG’s side of the story and what got him to his current spiritual status. Our efforts were met with a lot of derision and false accusations. So we have stopped trying.
We feel sorry for him now. As for reading his blog, we always need material to teach believers what to watch out for. Atheists can seem like nice people but underneath their friendly facade, is someone who will try their best to undermine your faith.
The best thing to do is go with Jesus and let him guide you when you talk to atheists. Do not fall into their traps as your faith can be shaken like BG’s was. And when you turn to the wrong people to get help, you will end up on the wrong side spiritually and lose your salvation. Just like BG did.”
Tee is a pretty obnoxious human being. I don’t normally get into the insults stuff, but occasionally things have to be said.
I don’t say this because of his views on abortion. Yes, I think he’s wrong, and actually the anti-choice lobby is so full of inconsistencies and contradictions that they actually think they’re wrong themselves, they just don’t realise it. My opinion comes because of the way in which he refers to those who identify as LGBTQ. He pretends to be tolerant to them, but then claims that homosexuals were never ‘marginalised’! What! Homosexuality in the UK was illegal in England until 1967, and the great mathematician to which he refers, Alan Turing, was convicted for his ‘crimes’, forced to undergo treatment we wouldn’t now deem humane for dogs, and committed suicide as a result. Not marginalised! FFS. And I haven’t even mentioned the US, or Iran or Saudi Arabia.
Then Tee refers to being tolerant towards LGBTQ people, but refers to them as sick perverts. I’m a straight white guy and I consider myself fortunate in this regard, because at least I don’t have to endure this bigoted hatred personally. But if I wasn’t the way I am then I would be neither sick nor perverted, I’d simply be as nature delivered. Every species of animal has individuals that exhibit homosexual behaviour, so it’s not a uniquely human instinct. Nature simply makes some people in ways that are different to the norm, in all sorts of ways, just as the majority of people are right handed but we tolerate left handedness. To refer to it in the way that Tee does diminishes him as a person, it casts a shroud around every opinion he expresses, even when he’s right, because he demonstrates that he can’t be trusted not to invest his opinions with emotion.
In many ways he’s the one who is sick.
We watched Benjamin Cumberbatch’s movie portrayal of Turing. His treatment was/is deplorable and disgusting.
Oh boy, I believe you mean Benedict Cumberbatch. I did a double take and then still had to check for the right name, as I don’t remember as well as I used to.
Yes, Benedict. Thanks 🙏 for catching my mistake.
To be honest, I thought I was having a stroke at first…Benjamin is too close to Benedict that I had to look it up, but felt so wrong LOL.
Umm…yeah. A quick google search will tell you that Alan Turing was arrested and found guilty for being gay. He was headed to prison, but was allowed to opt for castration. I guess that’s not marginalization in this assholes view. No surprise at all. Maybe the asshole thinks this is an acceptable solution, like plucking an eyeball.
Christians lead the charge in bigotry against LGBTQ people. Laws are proposed, and some are passed, to stop trans and non binary people getting government documents, Orr to control bathroom use, or otherwise regulate their existence. County clerks refuse marriage licenses because they are too Christian. Teachers purposely misgender students because “they can’t lie” (only other lies are ok). Restaurant and stores refuse service to LGBTQ people because they are Christian businesses. Churches endorse abusive and dangerous conversion therapy.
And this asshole refers to,the whole community as perverted.
His own words show him to be a bigoted, self righteous, judgmental asshole.
It’s funny, Sage, because the reality is LGBTQ people don’t want to go near Donald and his ilk. But just knowing there are people out there in that community upsets Donnie boy! Barely affects their lives, and if they’d just monitor what they read or watch they could avoid thinking about those icky people. But no, the Christian Nationalist wants to hurt you, wants to monitor what the rest of us do that isn’t affecting them, just because they hate people who are different than them. I’m a privileged white woman, and if Donald met me as a stranger in public he’d assume I am more like him as I live a quiet, modest, conservative life. Ah, but if he met me in person and saw my evil communist/socialist/Marxist/ leftist brain, he’d be fine with me being oppressed. Christian Nationalists want power and to rule us with an iron hand.
Tee Hee is basically a narcissist who likes getting a ride out of people. And now it turns out, he’s a Christian Dominionist and Fascist,as well !! I’ve known of the Dominionists for some time. Rushdoony has a lot of disciples out there. Anyway, they get off on seeing others come go harm, and are patiently waiting for the country to fall into their hands. Small wonder that so many people are leaving the country,to the point that immigration sites are crashing constantly. What does THAT tell you ? I watched some of the seasons of Handmaid’s Take, and yeah, the parallels are striking !
As I predicted, Tee felt led by the dead Jesus to answer my 25 questions for anti-abortionists/forced birthers.
https://theologyarchaeology.wordpress.com/2021/12/12/25-questions/
He also added:
#1. The solution to your existential angst David is this: don’t read my blog. I have explained to you why I use autobiographical statements in my writing several times.
The better solution is if BG does not like to be contradicted, criticized, or proven wrong, he should stop placing his content in the public sphere. he offers nothing of value and keeps boring people with repeated biographical statements that only have value to him.
He is a narccisist and has a great need for attention. We did our best to understand him and his reasons why but he doesn’t really want understanding, he wants attention.
….
The atheist has no moral ground to stand on and if they claim that they do, they would only be standing on subjective principles that carry no weight. Their moral codes do not trump God nor make them more moral than a Christian.
Abortion is wrong and any atheist who supports turning their wives, girlfriends, mothers into murderers is not much of a person. they are certainly not good friends either.
Love keeps people from making these mistakes and decisions. It does not permit their loved ones to do what is wrong and an act they would object to if they were facing someone ready to kill them now.
Depriving someone of life no matter which stage of life they are in, is wrong, it is sin and people should be punished appropriately. The death penalty is not wrong because it is a punishment for a crime. Name one crime an unborn child has committed?
Their only crime is to be falsely labeled by atheists and unbelievers, like BG, who hate Christ.
Tee also stated that he doesn’t like my humor, scarcasm, and snark. Oh my, consider me rebuked. I promise to never say again that David Tee lives in a dark, dank basement somewhere in the Philippines. 😂😂 So sorry, Charley.😂😂
He’s tiresome. He claims you’re a narcissist but it seems evident that he is the narcissist. Too bad you can’t totally block him forever.
The underlying point that renders Tee entirely wrong on the abortion debate is his use of science to determine his views. Science does not state that ‘life begins at conception’, it describes the reproductive processes that occur in the womb and the various stages that are reached. It is then up to philosophy to determine the rights that we attribute and the points at which we assign those rights. In short, people determine ‘personhood’.
Throughout all of time and all cultures personhood has begun at birth. Until someone is born they cannot be murdered. Tee’s argument, if followed to its logical conclusion, means that a birth certificate would become a conception certificate, nationality would depend on country of conception (good luck with that one!) and not birth, and women would start receiving maternity benefits at conception. In short, life does not begin at conception. The idea that it is otherwise is very new and has become a political issue, not a scientific one.
Incidentally, morality is entirely subjective, albeit based on collective thinking. There are objective facts that help us base our morality, but these are used only in shaping our subjective views. Tee is exactly the same. He bases his morality on the bible and on God, but that doesn’t make them objective. His decision to base his morality thus is a subjective choice, and no different to the general way in which we all base our morality.
Tee would love to have the number of friends, admirers, and blog readers Bruce has. Maybe he’s using the royal “we” so much to make himself look more numerous than he is. I see one man, alone, covetous and envious, with severe perceptual distortions, few if any friends, and having the trait of narcissism that all internet trolls have per Neuroscience News dot com. Meanwhile the happy community here just keeps on trucking while Tee sits on the toilet in his basement in the Philippines. So sad for him!
Mr Tee just wants to justify all his control-lust and bigotry by claiming it’s deity-approved.
That might be why the poor fellow thinks he is a ‘we’: We have listened carefully to BG and we have discussed his condition and we feel we are right and he is wrong because we are God in us! You lose BG. We love you so much!
Something else relating to abortion,or at least, contraception : most preachers will tell you that few people will make Heaven, the vast majority of those BORN will go to Hell- kids included, btw. So, my question is, knowing most have no chance of making it- why then push for large families, no contraception, much less abortion. So far, but for simply stating that it’s the luck of the draw, no one can justify the above dilemma.